perm filename F79.IN[LET,JMC]2 blob sn#554829 filedate 1981-01-09 generic text, type C, neo UTF8
COMMENT ⊗   VALID 00164 PAGES
C REC  PAGE   DESCRIPTION
C00001 00001
C00016 00002	∂03-Oct-79  0409	HPM  	Data Disc equivalent    
C00018 00003	∂03-Oct-79  0117	HPM  
C00019 00004	∂02-Oct-79  2315	SEK  	Logic seminar, latest news.  
C00020 00005	∂03-Oct-79  1540	LES  	DPY meeting   
C00021 00006	∂03-Oct-79  1641	TOB  	do you remember    
C00022 00007	∂03-Oct-79  1742	DPB  	colloquium    
C00023 00008	∂03-Oct-79  1919	ADMIN.GORIN at SU-SCORE 	Proposed meeting:   
C00024 00009	∂03-Oct-79  2143	LES  
C00025 00010	∂04-Oct-79  0022	RMS at MIT-AI (Richard M. Stallman)
C00029 00011	∂04-Oct-79  1533	CET  	Course Abstracts   
C00030 00012	04-Oct-79 (from RWW)
C00032 00013	∂05-Oct-79  0037	RMS at MIT-AI (Richard M. Stallman)
C00037 00014	∂05-Oct-79  0832	JRA  	status of conference    
C00042 00015	∂05-Oct-79  1103	JRA  	more conferencing...    
C00043 00016	∂05-Oct-79  1347	DPB  	use of SCORE for homework    
C00045 00017	∂05-Oct-79  1408	CET  
C00047 00018	∂05-Oct-79  1525	MFB   via SU-SCORE 	orals schedule 
C00048 00019	∂05-Oct-79  1941	JRA  
C00049 00020	∂05-Oct-79  2211	CLT  	??? 
C00051 00021	∂06-Oct-79  0842	DON   via Easy Street 	thanks but no thanks  
C00052 00022	∂06-Oct-79  2047	DON  	received this from Laird re Haunt 
C00053 00023	∂07-Oct-79  0253	MRC  	GSB status    
C00054 00024	∂07-Oct-79  0846	REM at MIT-MC (Robert Elton Maas) 	Legalities / Mail protocol and computer-run law   
C00059 00025	∂08-Oct-79  1000	JMC* 
C00060 00026	∂08-Oct-79  1120	TW  	Office terminal
C00062 00027	∂08-Oct-79  1257	HPM  
C00063 00028	∂08-Oct-79  1426	PAT  
C00065 00029	∂08-Oct-79  1855	ME   
C00066 00030	∂08-Oct-79  2302	ME   
C00067 00031	∂09-Oct-79  0948	CLT  	nonmon   
C00068 00032	∂09-Oct-79  1122	LCA  	letter   
C00069 00033	∂09-Oct-79  1655	DPB  	Recruiters in Classes???
C00073 00034	∂09-Oct-79  1727	RWW  
C00077 00035	∂09-Oct-79  1818	LES  	Office terminal    
C00078 00036	∂10-Oct-79  0043	SEK  	The Barwise Logic Seminar.   
C00079 00037	∂10-Oct-79  0812	DCO  
C00083 00038	∂10-Oct-79  1042	DCL  	Bell Labs. pitch   
C00084 00039	∂10-Oct-79  1205	DCO  
C00086 00040	∂10-Oct-79  2106	ROD  
C00087 00041	∂10-Oct-79  2125	REM at MIT-MC (Robert Elton Maas)  
C00091 00042	∂11-Oct-79  1715	WILKINS at SRI-KL (Wilkins ) 	mental qualities    
C00094 00043	∂12-Oct-79  0832	JRA  	conference status  
C00104 00044	∂12-Oct-79  0837	JRA  
C00105 00045	∂12-Oct-79  0923	CET  	MTC Qual 
C00106 00046	∂12-Oct-79  1002	DPB  	Forsythe lectures  
C00109 00047	∂12-Oct-79  1153	JRA  	pat hayes
C00110 00048	∂12-Oct-79  1231	RPG  	Pitch    
C00112 00049	∂12-Oct-79  2321	PAT  	10 copies
C00113 00050	∂13-Oct-79  0140	POURNE at MIT-AI (Jerry E. Pournelle) 	Dr.Possony says hello
C00114 00051	∂13-Oct-79  0800	JMC* 
C00115 00052	∂13-Oct-79  0800	JMC* 
C00116 00053	∂13-Oct-79  0915	PN  	Mail and file storage during the move   
C00118 00054	∂13-Oct-79  1806	EJM  	score for homework 
C00120 00055	∂13-Oct-79  1815	EJM  	Speakers for Tuesday colloqia
C00122 00056	∂13-Oct-79  1823	EJM  	Recruiters in classes   
C00123 00057	∂14-Oct-79  0129	RPG  	Haunt    
C00124 00058	∂14-Oct-79  0744	HPM  	orchids  
C00125 00059	∂14-Oct-79  1537	CLT  	PURGING  
C00127 00060	∂15-Oct-79  1136	LCA  
C00128 00061	∂15-Oct-79  1223	LES  	Purging  
C00129 00062	∂15-Oct-79  1430	TOB  	Lockheed 
C00130 00063	∂15-Oct-79  1450	ME  	new WAITS DM   
C00133 00064	∂15-Oct-79  2030	Bulnes at OFFICE-2 	hello.    
C00134 00065	∂15-Oct-79  2030	Bulnes at OFFICE-2 	in case my previous message did not get 
C00135 00066	∂16-Oct-79  0831	JRA  	call for papers    
C00136 00067	∂16-Oct-79  0956	JRA  	important letter   
C00139 00068	∂16-Oct-79  1339	DCL  	New Data Media terminals
C00141 00069	∂16-Oct-79  2031	Mark Crispin <Admin.MRC at SU-SCORE> 	AI Lab disk space at SCORE 
C00146 00070	∂16-Oct-79  2132	RWW  
C00148 00071	∂17-Oct-79  1113	EF at MIT-AI (Edward Fredkin) 
C00150 00072	∂17-Oct-79  1122	DCO  
C00153 00073	∂18-Oct-79  0122	LES  	Terminal tiff 
C00160 00074	∂18-Oct-79  0208	Great Pumpkin	Restored Files  
C00163 00075	∂22-Oct-79  1035	JRA  	updates  
C00165 00076	∂24-Oct-79  1041	JRA  	lisp conference    
C00172 00077	∂24-Oct-79  1444	RPG  	HPM 
C00173 00078	∂25-Oct-79  0259	ME  	downtime for HPM movie   
C00176 00079	∂25-Oct-79  1035	Mark Crispin <Admin.MRC at SU-SCORE> 	Dialnet sources  
C00177 00080	∂25-Oct-79  1505	g.eldre at SU-SCORE (Tim Eldredge) 	Dialnet  
C00179 00081	∂25-Oct-79  2019	Mark Crispin <Admin.MRC at SU-SCORE> 	[g.eldre: Dialnet]    
C00181 00082	∂26-Oct-79  0829	JRA  	north-holland update    
C00184 00083	∂26-Oct-79  1032	PAPERT at MIT-AI (Seymour Papert)  
C00185 00084	∂28-Oct-79  0753	PMF  
C00186 00085	∂17-Nov-79  1142	RWW  	HELLO    
C00187 00086	∂26-Nov-79  0449	RMS at MIT-AI (Richard M. Stallman)
C00188 00087	∂30-Nov-79  1013	JRA  	return (marginally)
C00193 00088	∂30-Nov-79  1116	TOB  	proposed move of robotics    
C00194 00089	∂30-Nov-79  1129	TOB  
C00198 00090	∂30-Nov-79  1411	LGC   via SU-SCORE  
C00199 00091	∂30-Nov-79  1418	LGC  
C00200 00092	∂30-Nov-79  1508	Morton at PARC-MAXC 	Re: request for information  
C00201 00093	∂30-Nov-79  2033	HPM  	∂30-Nov-79  1814	JMC  	xgpsyn     
C00203 00094	∂01-Dec-79  0145	HPM  	XGPSYN   
C00204 00095	∂02-Dec-79  2239	LGC   via SU-SCORE 	Reminder  
C00205 00096	∂03-Dec-79  1132	Lamport at SRI-KL 	logicians  
C00207 00097	∂04-Dec-79  0751	Sandelin at SUMEX-AIM 	possible meeting 
C00209 00098	∂04-Dec-79  1758	100  : MRC	TIP dialup procedures   
C00210 00099	∂05-Dec-79  1053	Horowitz at MIT-XX 	reprint permission for Lisp 1.5 manual  
C00212 00100	∂05-Dec-79  1133	Card at PARC-MAXC 	Re: reports     
C00219 00101	
C00220 00102	∂06-Dec-79  1628	TOB  	reference list
C00221 00103	∂06-Dec-79  1629	TOB  
C00224 00104	∂07-Dec-79  1026	TOB  
C00225 00105	∂07-Dec-79  1247	TOB  
C00226 00106	∂07-Dec-79  1609	Sandelin at SUMEX-AIM 	meeting
C00228 00107	∂08-Dec-79  1725	LES  
C00229 00108	∂09-Dec-79  1000	JMC*  via SU-TIP    
C00230 00109	∂10-Dec-79  1000	JMC*  via AMES-TIP  
C00231 00110	∂10-Dec-79  1237	LGC   via SU-TIP 	Discussion Notes 
C00232 00111	∂10-Dec-79  1556	HEARN at UTAH-20 	LISP Book   
C00233 00112	∂10-Dec-79  1756	LGC   via SU-SCORE 	Copies of Notes
C00234 00113	∂11-Dec-79  1435	LYN  	music party   
C00235 00114	∂11-Dec-79  1631	Wilkins at SRI-KL 	my thesis  
C00236 00115	∂11-Dec-79  1900	JMC*  via SU-TIP    
C00237 00116	∂12-Dec-79  0550	LES  	printing on Versatec    
C00239 00117	∂12-Dec-79  1506	CMB at MIT-ML (Clark M. Baker)
C00242 00118	∂13-Dec-79  0806	Sandelin at SUMEX-AIM 	meeting
C00243 00119	∂13-Dec-79  1711	MTC  	computer use by MTC
C00245 00120	∂13-Dec-79  1812	LGC  	Tomorrow at 2:00?  
C00246 00121	∂13-Dec-79  2316	LGC  	Monday at 2 -- ok  
C00247 00122	∂14-Dec-79  2010	JMC* 
C00248 00123	∂14-Dec-79  2023	REM at MIT-MC (Robert Elton Maas) 	PCNet status   
C00250 00124	∂14-Dec-79  2133	ARK  	DD terminals  
C00251 00125	∂15-Dec-79  0235	RWG at MIT-MC (Bill Gosper)   
C00252 00126	∂15-Dec-79  1755	LGC   via SU-TIP 	New version of notes available  
C00253 00127	∂17-Dec-79  0730	Sandelin at SUMEX-AIM 	symposium   
C00257 00128	∂17-Dec-79  0833	MAX  	terminal 
C00259 00129	∂17-Dec-79  0900	JMC*  via SU-TIP    
C00260 00130	∂17-Dec-79  0842	MAX  	mclisp   
C00265 00131	∂17-Dec-79  1528	Nilsson at SRI-KL (Nils Nilsson) 	Henry Firdman   
C00268 00132	∂18-Dec-79  0925	JK   
C00269 00133	∂18-Dec-79  0932	HVA  	POSTAGE CHARGE NUMBERS  
C00270 00134	∂18-Dec-79  0934	HVA  	JON DOYLE
C00271 00135	∂18-Dec-79  0935	HVA  	Other Mail    
C00272 00136	∂19-Dec-79  1026	Bmoore at SRI-KL (Bob Moore) 	bug in AIPHIL.LST   
C00273 00137	∂19-Dec-79  1636	TOB  
C00278 00138	∂19-Dec-79  1617	LES  	Lost again    
C00279 00139	∂20-Dec-79  0209	LES  	NS on SCORE   
C00280 00140	∂20-Dec-79  0229	ME  	NS on SCORE    
C00283 00141	∂20-Dec-79  1606	LES  
C00284 00142	∂20-Dec-79  1609	LGC  	Tomorrow (Friday)  
C00285 00143	∂20-Dec-79  1811	ROY   on TTY62 (at TV-66)  1811    
C00286 00144	∂21-Dec-79  1000	JMC* 
C00287 00145	∂21-Dec-79  1325	LGC  	No Hardcopy Available   
C00288 00146	∂21-Dec-79  1349	LES  
C00289 00147	∂21-Dec-79  1608	LES  
C00290 00148	∂22-Dec-79  0144	LES  
C00291 00149	∂23-Dec-79  1529	TOB  	hand proposal 
C00292 00150	∂23-Dec-79  2021	JMC   via SU-TIP 	rolex  
C00293 00151	∂23-Dec-79  2114	REM   via AMES-TIP 	Deficiencies in MacLISP here on SU-AI   
C00295 00152	∂24-Dec-79  1835	TOB  	display system
C00296 00153	∂25-Dec-79  1051	REM   via AMES-TIP 	CRUNCH of formatted documents 
C00298 00154	∂25-Dec-79  1719	REM   via AMES-TIP 	Software File Arrays - working
C00300 00155	∂25-Dec-79  2321	Feigenbaum at SUMEX-AIM 	(Response to message)    
C00303 00156	∂26-Dec-79  0038	LES  	FONDLE phantom
C00304 00157	∂27-Dec-79  1751	Nilsson at SRI-KL (Nils Nilsson) 	Party 
C00306 00158	∂28-Dec-79  1702	Mark Crispin <Admin.MRC at SU-SCORE> 	Tops-20 Dialnet code  
C00307 00159	∂28-Dec-79  2109	TOB  
C00308 00160	∂28-Dec-79  2254	TOB  
C00314 00161	∂30-Dec-79  0626	REM   via AMES-TIP 	English-text parsing and understanding in commercial environment 
C00317 00162	∂02-Jan-80  0911	Levinthal at SUMEX-AIM 	Chess 
C00318 00163	∂02-Jan-80  1254	BTH  	Concurrent Programming Seminar CS319E/EE385E
C00319 00164	∂02-Jan-80  1733	SJF  	Optimization visitor    
C00322 ENDMK
C⊗;
∂03-Oct-79  0409	HPM  	Data Disc equivalent    
To:   LES
CC:   JMC   
Robert Flexer (LES copied the data sheets on his display/digitizer board)
says he can build a data disc equivalent containing its own processor
(for character generation and protocol compatibility) in a single
IMSAI enclosure (smaller than a breadbox) for $25,000 (4am estimate,
subject to sleeping on, he says). At no extra cost, it would be able
to do a few things our DD can't, such as sync to an external signal, and
digitize into the bit planes, and read out from them into the computer.

He's also willing to design the interface to the 10 i/o bus.

∂03-Oct-79  0117	HPM  
Kicking the football in the lab gains you an extra 5 points.
apparently it ends up on the lawn!

∂02-Oct-79  2315	SEK  	Logic seminar, latest news.  
To:   "@FOL.DIS[FOL,RWW]" at SU-AI    
The Barwise logic seminar (7:00 Wed Oct 3, Math lounge) will be preceded
by a dinner at 5:30 (meet at the Stanford Barn).  Speaker is Fred Abramson,
new to the philosophy faculty, on "Theory of Indiscernibles in a Constructible
Universe".  I am NOT speaking on FOL until a later session; sorry for the
misimpression.  I don't know what direction the seminar will go in.  It is
not necessarily something extraordinary; I'm going primarily to meet some
logicians and thought others might want to know about it.

∂03-Oct-79  1540	LES  	DPY meeting   
REG proposes a meeting with FB at 11am Friday somewhere in Jax.  OK?

∂03-Oct-79  1641	TOB  	do you remember    
John
Do you remember A.I.Mlavsky (Eddie) who knew you
at MIT with Minsky?  I met him at the NSF Grantees
meeting where he asked about you and asked me to
mention him and ask you do you remember.  He is
executive director of Israel-US Industrial R&D
Foundation.
Tom

∂03-Oct-79  1742	DPB  	colloquium    
I'm desperate for a colloquium speaker for this coming Tuesday 10/9.
Doug Appelt suggested that besides you there are a bunch of heavywieghts
at the Center this quarter (Pat Hayes, ...)  Point me to somebody
who you think might do it, and I'll call on Thursday.  Other suggestions?
  -Denny

∂03-Oct-79  1919	ADMIN.GORIN at SU-SCORE 	Proposed meeting:   
Date:  3 Oct 1979 1916-PDT
From: ADMIN.GORIN at SU-SCORE
Subject: Proposed meeting:
To: REG at SU-AI, JMC at SU-AI, FB at SU-AI, LES at SU-AI

Forest proposes we meet at 11:00 Friday to discuss displays etc.

Can everyone make it?    Where should we meet?
-------
The time is ok for me, but I leave at noon.  How about the Dept. Chairman's
conference room?
∂03-Oct-79  2143	LES  
To:   REG at SU-AI
CC:   JMC at SU-AI, FB at SU-AI  
DPY meeting
JMC and I can make it Friday at 11am.  How about somewhere in Jax?
Say, the Chairman's Conference Room?

∂04-Oct-79  0022	RMS at MIT-AI (Richard M. Stallman)
Date: 4 OCT 1979 0040-EDT
From: RMS at MIT-AI (Richard M. Stallman)
To: JMC at MIT-AI

Has the Sato thesis been returned to you yet?
I remember you said that you didn't know whether there were any finite
models, but it seems that Sato's construction yields a lot of them.
First of all, it yields the trivial models in which you have any number
of worlds with any facts you like but nobody ever knows anything.
That much I'm certain of, having checked it while I still had the
paper in my possession.  However, I think there are finite nontrivial
models made very simply also.  His procedure is to take any set of
formulas closed under subformulas, and then certain subsets of that
set correspond to worlds of the model.  If you take a finite set of
formulas including some that include modalities, you should get a finite
nontrivial model.

Or was it a different theory that you weren't sure had finite models?

The Sato paper got back, thank you.

The circumscription paper is finished.  Its source is circum.new[s79,jmc]
if you are interested in FTPing it.  Otherwise, I'll send you a paper
copy if you want, or you can wait for it to appear in the non-monotonic
issue of the AI journal or as a Stanford AI Memo.

I don't remember saying that anything might not have finite models.
What I think I did say was that I wanted to axiomatize the wise men
and S and P puzzles so that there would be no merging accesibility
paths in order that my definition of learning would work properly.
That would force there to be only infinite models and I know how
to do it.  All I need is an axiom that says that a world can be
accessible only from one world other than itself.  The point is
that a merging of accessibility paths may be compatible with
an initial state of knowledge, but an inconsistency could arise
when I define learning as allowing only those accessibility relations
compatible with what is learned.  If the same world were accessible
in two ways, learning something might want to cut off one of its
outgoing accessibilities from one point of view and not from another.
I lose nothing by postulating non-merging.
∂04-Oct-79  1533	CET  	Course Abstracts   
To:   "@FAC.DIS[1,DPB]" at SU-AI 

The students who are doing Course Abstracts for the Academic Information
Center sent the forms directly to the professors.  Please send them to
me when you complete them so I will have a record of the abstracts for
Winter Quarter.

They were only sent to the 100 level course instructors.

Thanks,
Carolyn

04-Oct-79 (from RWW)
The Aiello letter is fine except that I have changed the last phrase
which was open to the interpretation that we think she might be good
enough for the Italians even though she might not be suited to an
American univerity position.  If joint publications are in the works,
this should be mentioned even though details can be left for her resume.
Ask Patte to get it on a letter for me to sign.
Use this modified version.

Dear sirs,

Luigia Aiello has been a visitor at the Stanford Artificial Laboratory
on two occasions  -  January 1973 to August 1974, and February 1979
until the present.  During her first visit here she worked with
Richard Weyhrauch on the LCF project and they produced several papers
together.  On her currrent visit she is involved with the formal 
reasoning project and is working with the FOL system.
She has made considerable contributions to both these
projects and as a result we are currently augmenting her Italian 
financial support.  I believe that she is well suited for a
university teaching position.

∂05-Oct-79  0037	RMS at MIT-AI (Richard M. Stallman)
Date: 5 OCT 1979 0335-EDT
From: RMS at MIT-AI (Richard M. Stallman)
To: JMC at MIT-AI

I don't think that there is really any problem about shared
pointers in the accessibility relation.  Suppose that there
Suppose that, given a certain person and time, it is consistent
to have shared pointers to the same world in a certain spot.
Suppose that at the next instant this person learns something
such that those worlds would have to be separate.  Well, then,
we now know it's not and never was possible for any model
of this particular act of learning to have had shared structure
at that spot.
When learning is treated by a time parameter in assertions,
it is taking a sort of 5th dimensional view in which all instants
of time are true "all at once" in the theory.  The things that
determine what things people learn are just axioms of the theory,
and it's no surprise that the choice of axioms is going to restrict
what models fit.  Shared substructure will sometimes fit with
some of the theorems and not all.  Sometimes it will fit with all.
It will fit in different places depending on what things people learn,
but that is no problem.

The concept you seem to be worried about is that of finding a structure
of accessibility relation which is universal in that any theory has
a model which consists of that relation or a subset of it
with appropriate facts attached.

Does this make any sense to you?

It might make sense to prohibit shared substructure in a program
which tried to generate a model for the theory while (of course)
not knowing all the theorems.  If it worked by time steps, and it
tried altering the model at one step so that it still fits when the
next step's theorems are added, then it might have an easier task
if it had no shared substructure; but then, having something to
split some substructure wouldn't be too hard either.
The main point is the difference between this and the mathematical
considerations of models for the theories considered as wholes.

By the way, I can't figure out in my head what an example would
be in which a world can be reached two ways but then after some
new knowledge it has to be split because it needs to point at
different other worlds depending on the path.  Do you know
of a simple one?

I agree with the considerations of your message.  It made me nervous
that I couldn't be sure that learning in a particular model made sense,
but I don't see anything wrong with the idea that this just excludes
particular shared pointer models.  Also I don't have an actual example
in which shared pointers do harm, but my present intuition is that
it wouldn't be difficult to make one.  I'll think about it.

Misstatement.  I meant "... couldn't be sure that learning in an ARBITRARY
model made sense ..."
∂05-Oct-79  0832	JRA  	status of conference    
john,

things are moving very nicely. Dan Friedman and Richard Fateman have joined
us. i have not heard from the overseas people yet, so i am preparing  a follow-up
letter with the updated information; perhaps that will induce labor.

The stanford conference office is holding space for us august 24-27; they are 
not yet sure of the food services yet (some massive constuction may happen
next summer) they will need a letter from you  confirming the reservation; i will
get the details for you.  

in case stanford's facilities fall through, santa clara
is also holding space for us (they are actually cheaper, so maybe we can
bargin down stanford's greed).

i have located a reputable printer who will guarantee three-week printing and
binding of 400 copies at 300-500 pages; therefore i have dropped the printing
period to six weeks. 

Also  several people have suggested that 10 weeks for 
author revision is overly generous; i dropped that period to 7 weeks (still
generous).  

i left ten weeks for the review process (that should be done well),
and placed the seven weeks we gained, back in the paper preparation phase;
that gives a twenty-week period: much more satisfactory, i think.

however i expect the authors to put that extra time to good use, supplying
a draft paper instead of an extended abstract.

i sent a note to raj this morning; letter to acm goes out today to list the
conference, and to ask for "cooperation" from acm.

i appears that we can do it without sponsorship; i'm willing to front the 
little expenses (phones and mail, etc) until the advanced reg. fees appear.
given that stanford (or santa clara) will wait and the publishing bills
don't come due till late, it seems that we can maintain control and be in a
position to do this again, and again ...

the only sour note so far was that neither danny nor warren could join;
we really should have an interlisper (but most of them are so uncouth)
i've asked boyer, but he's a user, not a environment-type person.

of course, standard lisp should be represented too, but if everyone accepts
we've got a dozen on the committe already.

There is no reason that I see for Stanford LISP to be represented.  Almost
all of us have switched to Maclisp, and those that haven't don't prefer
Stanford LISP but just have large programs to maintain.  I am dubious
about the value of ACM co-operation; they have a reputation for imposing
conditions.  I think this applies only to their "sponsorship" - not to
listing it as a coming event in their publications.
∂05-Oct-79  1103	JRA  	more conferencing...    
 ... of course there's Stoyan in Dresden, and  the USSR. should we
try for membership there?  
							john

Stoyan should be invited to be on the committee and to give a paper.
The probability of his being allowed out is epsilon so nothing should
hang on it.
∂05-Oct-79  1347	DPB  	use of SCORE for homework    
To:   "@FAC.DIS[1,DPB]" at SU-AI, admin.mrc at SU-SCORE   
 ∂05-Oct-79  1227	CLT  	use of SCORE for homework    
Several of my cs206 students have been asking about using SCORE for
doing their homework.  Is this officially a no-no?  I gather LOTS
is already approaching impossibility (45 minute ques this early in the
term?!).  I have no intention of asking where the homework is done, but
if there is a policy of no homework on SCORE, I'll avoid putting up
the suped up version of MACLISP there.		Carolyn

[People who already have access to score can presumably use it for
any purpose.  I think the official posture should be the one you
have adopted: just don't mention it or ask where the homework is done.
Nobody gets a score account just because they are in a class, however.

Anybody out there disagree with this point of view?

-Denny]

∂05-Oct-79  1408	CET  
To:   "@FAC.DIS[1,DPB]" at SU-AI 
Dear Faculty Member;
     We are looking to you for help in finding speakers for our Tuesday
afternoon colloquia.  If you know someone who is engaged in research that
relates to computer science, please consider inviting him or her to speak at
the colloquium.  Please contact Denny Brown or Carolyn Tajnai about the 
scheduling and other matters.  (Last minute arrangements are discouraged
but may be possible.)
     Please list below people whom you would like to see at the colloquium -
i.e., people you would come to see.  (return list to Carolyn Tajnai or CET at
SAIL)

					Jock Mackinlay
					Student Representative
					Colloquium Committee

∂05-Oct-79  1525	MFB   via SU-SCORE 	orals schedule 
how about friday nov 30 at 2:15. that's ok
please confirm.

∂05-Oct-79  1941	JRA  
i meant to say "standard" lisp (tony hearn) not "stanford" lisp

∂05-Oct-79  2211	CLT  	??? 
I received the following query.  I can answer most of the it.  
What about the funding?
Does someone/agency get credit for bringing Drew out?  If so who?


 ∂05-Oct-79  1619	BOBROW at PARC-MAXC2 	Credit line for Nonmonotonic lgic confeence
Date:  5 OCT 1979 1616-PDT
From: BOBROW at PARC-MAXC2
Subject: Credit line for Nonmonotonic lgic confeence
To:   talcott at SAIL

I am putting together a special issue of the AI journal which
will contain all the papers presented at said conference which you
and John organized ( I have been told).  I would like to give
credit to the conference and the organizers for stimulating the
special issue.  Will you please tell me the dates, the exact title,
who to credit (You, John, funding agency, SAIL???) etc.
Thanks.
danny
-------

∂06-Oct-79  0842	DON   via Easy Street 	thanks but no thanks  
Inspired by your having found an answer, implying that it wasn't totally
random, I went back and retried some of the things I had tried initially,
and succeeded in smoking the dope.  Apparently "light match" always says
the matches are wet, which is why I had trouble before.  (I've now griped.)

∂06-Oct-79  2047	DON  	received this from Laird re Haunt 
By the way,  McCarthy contacted me about a bug and I might have given him
the impression that it was your fault that you had an old version.
Please inform him that in two weeks he will not be able to seduce the damsel
with his wetsuit on.

Speaking of the wetsuit, did you know that if you put the wetsuit on when
you find it but drop all the wetsuit will be on the floor.  Nevertheless,
it will protect you in the water.  Indeed a magic wetsuit.
∂07-Oct-79  0253	MRC  	GSB status    
Their front-end PDP-11 has been screwing up, crashing their system every
time a modem dials up.  It's not surprising that they've disconnected all
modems there until DEC gets the problem fixed.

I have gotten no reply from ROB from either of my messages about hooking
up the new VADIC, and it isn't hooked up either.

∂07-Oct-79  0846	REM at MIT-MC (Robert Elton Maas) 	Legalities / Mail protocol and computer-run law   
Date: 7 OCT 1979 1146-EDT
From: REM at MIT-MC (Robert Elton Maas)
Subject: Legalities / Mail protocol and computer-run law
To: DCC at MIT-MC, Joe.Newcomer at CMU-10A, GEOFF at SRI-KA
CC: JMC at SU-AI, REM at SU-AI

    Date:  4 October 1979 2348-EDT
    From: Joe.Newcomer at CMU-10A
    [Text]: Note by GEOFF on 5 Oct 1979 0910-PDT
    [Text]: With Joe's permission i am sending this to one and all.
    Redistributed-To: HOME-SAT at AI
    Redistributed-By: GEOFF at SRI-KA
    Redistributed-Date:  5 Oct 1979
[Comment by REM:  Peter Deutsch did a good job of flushing the frills from
 Arpanet MAIL protocol and giving us just the essentials.  Can you imagine
 trying to explain the above to hobbyists who are trying to write a MAIL
 program for an 8K PET, and seeing that all the above is implemented
 correctly and compatibly on all the different personal computer systems??]

	... ...
    This recollection makes the notion of "using for advantage" one of those
    notions which gets written into a law for the purpose of keeping lawyers
    employed interpreting what it means.
[Comment by REM: Since the only purpose of juries is to decide the facts;
 they are instructed by the judge as to what the law means; it would be
 reasonable for a computer instead of the jurists' recollections of the
 judges instructions and of the attorneys' distortions to perform the actual
 translation of facts into verdict.  A legislature (congress etc.) would
 thus draft laws as programs which would ask the jurer or other user
 questions like "Did the defendant use the property or service to obtain
 financial advantage for himself or anyone he knows?" and "Did that f.a.
 exceed the investment he made in order to obtain access to the p. or s.?".
 Each jurer would type in (or recite to a terminal operator) the answers
 to each question the program asks (some questions would be omitted because
 of the answers to preceding qustions).  A verdict would be computed
 separately for each juror, thus a not-guilty verdict could be
 unanimous even though one juror said no property was taken and another
 said it was taken with permission and another said it didn't exceed
 the investment, or a guilty verdict could be unanimous even though the
 dollar amounts stolen varied between the different jurists' opinions.
 An indictment would of course consist of the index number(s) of the
 program(s) to be used.  After the verdict (or hung jury non-verdict) the
 complete set of answers would appear in the transcript (permuted and with
 jurors' names detached to protect the individual jurors from reprisals)
 and could be used to figure out why a jury was hung or to help attorneys
 prepare the case for appeal. -- This idea copyright (C) 1979 by Robert Maas.]
[Gee, imagine, copyright notices in electronic mail!!]

∂08-Oct-79  1000	JMC* 
Mazda

∂08-Oct-79  1120	TW  	Office terminal
To:   LES at SU-AI, JMC at SU-AI, DPB at SU-AI, FB at SU-AI    
In the light of some recent discussions, I realized I wasn't
clear what the potential was for a terminal in my Jacks office
after the move.  At the moment there is none.  I have a DataMedia
which I bought on the Xerox grant specifically for the purpose
of having a home terminal to be able to avoid driving down to
Palo Alto every day.  I am not sure what the allocation plan
is for the Datadisks when they come to campus, but would like
to have one in my office if possible.  If that cannot be done
because my Xerox grant doesn't bring sufficient money in under
an appropriate category, then I would like to find out what
provision the department is making for terminals for faculty
members who don't already have one on a grant.  I am aware
of the long term plans for a terminal system, but at the
moment am worried about the period starting this October
and lasting at least through the academic year.  I'm not
sure whether this is a matter for Les, John, Denny, or Forest
so I'm sending it to all.
Thanks --t

∂08-Oct-79  1257	HPM  
have you tried simply being in posession of orchid when you go mad?

∂08-Oct-79  1426	PAT  
 ∂07-Oct-79  1327	JMC  	references    
There were two special issues of Reviews of Modern Physics containing
reports of American Physical Society studies on nuclear energy.  One
discussed reactor safety and the other the fuel cycle and waste
disposal.  Please get me the precise references including exact titles
and dates.  The physics library will have it.   I don't need the
documents themselves.
-----

Report of the American Physical Society by the Study Group on Nuclear
	Fuel Cycles and Waste Management, Reviews of Modern Physics,
	Vol. 50, No. 1, Part 2, January 1978.

Report of the American Physical Society by the Study Group on Light-Water
	Reactor Safety, Reviews of Modern Physics,
	Vol. 47, Supplement No. 1, Summer 1975.

∂08-Oct-79  1855	ME   
 ∂08-Oct-79  1843	JMC  
About how much disk will we recover when we separate from the musicians?

ME - About 3500 tracks (of quotas).  Of course, we won't get it back until
the musicians have had a chance to transfer it to their new computer.
I don't understand the units.  How many tracks are there, and what
is a typical quota of 150K words in those units.
∂08-Oct-79  2302	ME   
 ∂08-Oct-79  2038	JMC  
ME - About 3500 tracks (of quotas).  Of course, we won't get it back until
the musicians have had a chance to transfer it to their new computer.

I don't understand the units.  How many tracks are there, and what
is a typical quota of 150K words in those units.

ME - 3500 tracks is about 7800K.  One track is 2.25K.  There are 15,485
tracks per pack, or about 93,000 tracks in the 6-pack file system (not
counting the UDP).  An allocation of 150 is about 65 tracks.

∂09-Oct-79  0948	CLT  	nonmon   
what's the word on funding?

∂09-Oct-79  1122	LCA  	letter   
John, thank you very much for the letter you wrote for me. I have
appreciated it very much, Gigina

∂09-Oct-79  1655	DPB  	Recruiters in Classes???
To:   CET at SU-AI
CC:   DPB at SU-AI, "@FAC.DIS[1,DPB]" at SU-AI  
 ∂09-Oct-79  1559	CET  	Bell Labs
Two "Advance Recruiters" are here from Bell Labs.  They want to make
arrangements to have Bell Reps go to CS Classes and make a pitch.  I told
them I was opposed to it, but would defer to your decision.  I told them
if we let Bell do it, we would be opening the doors to all other Indus.
Affiliate Companies.  They said the other Depts. had suggested it.  I
countered that other departments probably had to try harder to find jobs
for their students.  Also, I thought the faculty would be opposed.
??
Second, she wants "to touch base with you"on Friday to tell you about Bell
and have you recommend students.  I was rather discouraging.
??
I will put up their posters.  
Please advise.
-Carolyn

[I agree that we should keep these folks out of classes.  This would be
a serious invasion of the students' and faculty's privacy.  [Anybody
disagree?]  We already have mechanisms, (mainly the Forum) for job
placement by STUDENT INITIATIVE.  No, I don't want to talk them if I can
get out of it, but will do so if they are very insistent.  Schedule for
1:30 so I'm sure to leave for class at 2.  -Denny]

My opinion is that letting Bell Lab make a pitch is a good idea.  If it
gets out of hand we can either limit it or stop it.  A more genuine
interaction between industry and the academic world is desirable.
However, it should be tried out rather gingerly with pitches in only one
or two classes where the instructors agree.  Alternatively, we could ask
them to give a seminar at a time of their convenience on work at Bell
Labs.  If we say we're trying it out, we don't have to let anyone else
do it until and unless we decide we like it and what form it should take.
This is assuming the recruiters are actually researchers and not just
random personnel men.
∂09-Oct-79  1727	RWW  
To:   "@FOL.DIS[FOL,RWW]"   
 ∂09-Oct-79  1301	Waldinger at SRI-KL (Richard Waldinger) 	rona's talk at sri.
Date:  9 Oct 1979 1259-PDT
From: Waldinger at SRI-KL (Richard Waldinger)
Subject: rona's talk at sri.
To:   rww at SAIL, suzman at SAIL
cc:   waldinger

Date:  8 Oct 1979 1515-PDT
From: Jelmyer
Subject: Theorem-proving Talk by Rona Gurkewitz, Friday, 2 PM, K2042 (AIC Conference Room)
To:   AIC Staff:, csl:

Abstract:


      EXPERIMENTS WITH A METAMATHEMATICALLY EXTENSIBLE PROOFCHECKER
		
			By Rona Gurkewitz
			Courant Institute


     Implementation of an interactive meta-extensible proofchecker will
be described as well as a methodology for 'structured' theorem proving.
As an example, the extension of a Hilbert-type proof system to a natural
deduction system will be discussed.  A central concern is the long-term 
reliability of the system after repeated extension, in particular, after
the addition of many new proof methods as derived rules of inference.  To
this effect, proofs of suitable metatheorems may have to be presented to
and checked by the system before it incorporates an extension.

    Derived rules may also be used 'informally'.  Rules are formulas in a 
formal system, and when used 'informally' they can be viewed as transformations
(macros) for taking a proof with the 'unofficial' rule into a proof in the
'official' formal system, which the proofchecker can then check.

    Formal proof systems may be thought of as programming languages.  One use
of meta-extension corresponds to bootstrapping an initial formal system to a
'higher-level' formal system.  Another use is in theorem proving by successive
transformations of a 'higher level' proof.  This suggests that the process of
developing complex proofs is analogous to that of developing complex programs.



-------
←←←←←←←←←←←←←←←←←←←←←←←←←←←←←←←←←←←←←←←←←←←←←←←←←←←←←←←←←←←←←←←←←←←←←←←←←←←←←←←←
 Can you publicize this talk at the AI Lab?
The room is in Building 30. The lobby will be alerted. The building is on
Ravenswood across from Pine St (for anyone who hasn't been). 

Thanks
Richard
-------

∂09-Oct-79  1818	LES  	Office terminal    
To:   TW at SU-AI
CC:   JMC at SU-AI, DPB at SU-AI, FB at SU-AI    
OK, we have you slated for a DataDisc terminal.

∂10-Oct-79  0043	SEK  	The Barwise Logic Seminar.   
To:   "@FOL.DIS[FOL,RWW]"   
Will meet Thursdays 10-12 am for the rest of the quarter.
Lunch afterwards at the faculty club.  For more information, see the
notice posted on the bulletin board above the drinking fountain next
to the mail boxes.  Oct. 11=Fred Abramson "The Story of 0#" (contd.).

∂10-Oct-79  0812	DCO  
To:   "@GROUP1[1,DCO]" 
Richard Waldinger asked me to pass this around ...

 ∂10-Oct-79  0806	Waldinger at SRI-KL (Richard Waldinger) 	talk notice   
Date: 10 Oct 1979 0804-PDT
From: Waldinger at SRI-KL (Richard Waldinger)
Subject: talk notice
To:   dco at SAIL
cc:   waldinger

Date:  8 Oct 1979 1515-PDT
From: Jelmyer
Subject: Theorem-proving Talk by Rona Gurkewitz, Friday, 2 PM, K2042 (AIC Conference Room)
To:   AIC Staff:, csl:

Abstract:


      EXPERIMENTS WITH A METAMATHEMATICALLY EXTENSIBLE PROOFCHECKER
		
			By Rona Gurkewitz
			Courant Institute


     Implementation of an interactive meta-extensible proofchecker will
be described as well as a methodology for 'structured' theorem proving.
As an example, the extension of a Hilbert-type proof system to a natural
deduction system will be discussed.  A central concern is the long-term 
reliability of the system after repeated extension, in particular, after
the addition of many new proof methods as derived rules of inference.  To
this effect, proofs of suitable metatheorems may have to be presented to
and checked by the system before it incorporates an extension.

    Derived rules may also be used 'informally'.  Rules are formulas in a 
formal system, and when used 'informally' they can be viewed as transformations
(macros) for taking a proof with the 'unofficial' rule into a proof in the
'official' formal system, which the proofchecker can then check.

    Formal proof systems may be thought of as programming languages.  One use
of meta-extension corresponds to bootstrapping an initial formal system to a
'higher-level' formal system.  Another use is in theorem proving by successive
transformations of a 'higher level' proof.  This suggests that the process of
developing complex proofs is analogous to that of developing complex programs.



-------
------------------------------------------------------------------------

Here it is. The talk is in Building 30 (my building) at SRI. For those
who haven't been there, its at Ravenswood and Pine.  The lobby will be
alerted.  Rona is a student of Martin Davis's. The talk is on in-progress
thesis work.

Thanks
Richard
-------

∂10-Oct-79  1042	DCL  	Bell Labs. pitch   
To:   DPB, CET
CC:   JMC   
Carolyn,
Did Bell Labs. say what was wrong with the present methods of making their
faclities, work and jobs known?
It seems to me that job recruiting in classes is entirely out of place
unless they have some very good reason for it. The justification should be
placed squarely on them - e.g, in writing.
I am reminded of the time DEC tried to use the ARPAnet mail to advertise a
new computer. That only happened once - some trends have to be stamped on.

∂10-Oct-79  1205	DCO  
To:   "@GROUP[1,DCO]" at SU-AI   
		PROGRAM VERIFICATION AND ANALYSIS SEMINAR
				and
			CONCURRENCY SEMINAR

PLACE:    ERL 237

TIME:     2:15 p.m., Tuesday, October 16
      
TITLE:    Verifying Network Protocols Using Temporal Logic

SPEAKER:  Brent Hailpern, Stanford University

Abstract:

	Temporal logic is a modal logic used to reason about events in the
future.  Its use in verifying parallel programs in general, and network
protocols in particular, will be discussed.  The alternating-bit protocol
(presented by G.  Bochmann in the last two weeks) will be the major
example for this talk and a proof of both safety and liveness properties
will be presented.

∂10-Oct-79  2106	ROD  
Martha Coyote would like you to call her.

∂10-Oct-79  2125	REM at MIT-MC (Robert Elton Maas)  
Date: 11 OCT 1979 0025-EDT
From: REM at MIT-MC (Robert Elton Maas)
To: JMC at SU-AI
CC: REM at SU-AI, DEK at SU-AI

I looked in Knuth AOCP 6.2.2 (Binary trees) and 6.2.3 (Balanced trees)
but couldn't find any good algorithm for maintaining a constantly-updated
tree so that it is nearly optimal with respect to the frequency of access
to the various nodes (i.e. it should be nearly balanced but frequently
accessed nodes should be nearer the root).  I therefore wrote an ad hoc
set of MacLISP functions that maintain such a tree tolerably.  After any
update (new node or increment to an existing count), on the way back up
to the trunk during returning from recursive calls it checks each node
to see if it has become severly unbalanced, i.e. 2*(son+node) < daughter,
in which case it rebalances the node by pulling some daughter structure
up to the top and distributing its son-ward nodes and the node itself
into the son structure, making one of the daughter nodes replace
the node.  The rebalancing uses a 1:1 threshold, i.e. son+node < daughter,
for deciding to rebalance deeper, thus pre-balancing things that aren't
really bad yet but are getting unbalanced.

The purpose of all this is to maintain an incore dictionary for an adaptive
word-based data-compression program.  I plan to use standard REM left-context
methods to compress (1) delimiter stream (2) new words in dictionary
(including words forgotten when the dictionary got full earlier and had to
be purged) and (3) cases of words and other misc. decisions.  Three standard
cases will be handled, "lower", "Capitalized" and "UPPER".  Other words such
as "McCarthy" will be kept in a separate dictionary and handled differently.
I suspect that for computer programs and other limited-vocabulary files
this will be superior to straight REM left-context methods, but much more
complicated and not feasible a year ago before MacLISP was working at SU-AI,
and not even conceivable before the IRSM invention of 1978 Feb 12.
(I'll probably be doing most debugging at MIT-MC or other ITS sites due
to superior debugging facilities such as the BS and STEP packages.)  I have
previously written a file I/O package to do input of various format (SOS, ETV)
files which SU-AI likes to have treated specially (flushing line numbers and
optional flushing ETV directory), and a TTY interface that makes INCHRW and
INCHRS work the same on SU-AI and on ITS.  Everything seems to be working ...

∂11-Oct-79  1715	WILKINS at SRI-KL (Wilkins ) 	mental qualities    
Date: 11 Oct 1979 1659-PDT
From: WILKINS at SRI-KL (Wilkins )
Subject: mental qualities
To: jmc at SU-AI

John,
I just got around to reading "Ascribing Mental Qualities to 
Machines".  AI people (especially the Newell-Simon camp)
have been ascribing mental qualities rather sloopily, alienating
philosophers and others.  You addressed a problem that sorely needed
attention and gave a lot of insight.

Have you read John Searle's "Notes on Artificial Intelligence"?
I have a copy of his second draft where he "proves" that machines
can never have intentions or understanding, and can send it to you
if you'd like it.  While I have answered Searle's arguments in my
mind and think you present a much more reasonable way of looking
at mental qualities, I would still be very interested to hear your
reaction to Searle's argument.

By the way, PARADISE has productions which do things analogous to
noticing (to use the example in your discussion of Dennett) that
black has a backward pawn on Q3, and then posting a concept which
tells the system to pressure this pawn in order to cramp black's 
position.  (Certainly a human can best deal with PARADISE by ascribing
such a concept to it.)

Would you like me to send you the Searle paper?
Cheers, Dave
-------
SEARLE[E79,JMC] is the source and SEARLE.XGP[E79,JMC] the xgp version
of a reply to Searle's second draft.  If you want a paper copy, message
Patte to send you one.  I shall be away for two weeks, but after the
first of November, I will be glad to discuss these matters with you.
Perhaps you would like to visit our AI and philosophy group at the
Behavioral Science Center for lunch sometime.
∂12-Oct-79  0832	JRA  	conference status  
To:   "@TLC.DIS[1,JRA]" at SU-AI 

October 12, 1979

Dear Committee Member:

Here is more information on the LISP Conference.

The Committee now includes:  John R. Allen, Richard Fateman, Dan Friedman,
Eiichi Goto,  Tony Hearn,  Carl Hewitt,  Alan Kay,  Joachim Laubsch,  John
McCarthy, Gianfranco Prini, Erik Sandewall, and Carolyn Talcott. Represent
atives from France and England  are still to be  heard from, but we're  in
excellent shape.

The schedule is much  more definite now, but  still many of the  questions
that I sent you remain unresolved; I am attaching the qestionaire again.

I made an error in the draft  schedule.  I had meant to write "each  paper
will be read  by three members".  Instead, it came  out "each member  will
read three papers". 

I have located a  quality printer and binder;  both Stanford and U.  Santa
Santa Clara  are  holding space  for  us; ACM  has  been notified  of  the
conference and its dates;  AISB knows about  the conference already,  both
AISB and EATCS will  be sent the Call,  and other information. Of  course,
the ARPA community will  be notified. If you  know of other  organizations
which should be notified, please let me know.

The major hurdle is the  Call for Papers.  I am  attaching a draft of  the
Call for Papers;  it is only  a draft  so please send  comments! The  Call
should posted from Stanford no later than October 22, 1979.

Thank you all  both for your  acceptance.  This will  be an enjoyable  and
memorable conference.


John

phones and addresses

home (408) 353-3857, 
John Allen  Stanford 497-4971, 
Ruth Davis  U. Santa Clara 984-4358

JRA@su-ai, RED@su-ai,
18215 Bayview Dr.
Los Gatos, 95030
--------------------------------------------

Oct 12 *********** DRAFT DRAFT DRAFT ***********

.select 4
.begin center
CALL FOR PAPERS

1980 LISP Conference
.end
.select 1

The 1980 LISP Conference  hosted by Stanford University,  will be held  on
the Stanford campus, August 24-27, 1980.

%2PURPOSE%1
Many areas of contemporary computer science have their spiritual roots  in
developments related to  LISP.  The impact  of LISP on  AI is well  known;
this conference will  emphasize these other  contributions of LISP.  These
areas  include   machine   architecture,   systems   design,   programming
methodology and technology,  and a  theory of computation.   The call  for
papers reflects this breadth.


%2TOPICS%1 
The following  topics are typical, but not exclusive: 
.begin indent 5,10
%2Languages and Theory.%1 
Applicative languages, Object-oriented languages, Proving correctness
of LISP programs, Mathematics and formal semantics of LISP-like  languages.

%2Programming Aspects%1 Programming tools and environments
for LISP-like languages, applications of these ideas to other languages.

%2Architecture.%1 The design and implementation of LISP hardware,
Adaption of existing machines, 
Specially designed LISP machines.

%2Applications.%1 Non-traditional applications of LISP. This area, of
course, is not easily categorized.

.end

%2PAPER SUBMITTAL%1 Authors are requested to send (*** =size of committee)
copies 
of a draft paper (word count ≤ ***) by  March 14, 1980 to:
.BEGIN tabit1(15)
Conference President
John R. Allen
Stanford Artificial Intelligence Lab
Stanford University
Stanford California 94305


.END
The abstract should provide sufficient detail to allow the committee
to apply  uniform criteria for acceptance. Appropriate references and
comparison to extant work should be included. The papers will be "blind
refereed"; therefore traces of authorship should not appear within the body
of the paper. 

Authors will  be notified of acceptance or rejection by May 23, 1980.
For inclusion in the proceedings, final papers are due at the above 
address by July 11, 1980.

%2PROGRAM COMMITTEE.%1 The committe consists of:
John R. Allen, 
Richard Fateman,
Dan Friedman,
Eiichi Goto,
Tony Hearn,
Carl Hewitt, 
Alan Kay,
Joachim Laubsch,
John McCarthy,
Gianfranco Prini,
Erik Sandewall,
Carolyn Talcott,
(***** and  a few others including representatives from
France, and England.*****)


In charge of Local Arrangements is:
.BEGIN TABIT1(15);
Dr. Ruth E. Davis
Department of EECS
University of Santa Clara
Santa Clara, California   95053
.END


%2MEETING FORMAT.%1
Besides the formal sessions, we expect to have several
demonstrations, including LISP machines.

Evening sessions  may be established, and informal workshops will be 
encouraged.


%2PANEL DISCUSSION.%1 Tuesday evening, August 26, 1980, there will be a 
panel discussion on the
topic "What is LISP?". Even informal conversations will 
elicit several divergent if not contradictory views of LISP;
a organized effort should prove even more illuminating.

--------------------------------------------
oct 12     quest.ion[1,jra]

questions preceded with ** are most urgent.



1. should we have parallel sessions? evening sessions? workshops?

2. committee members state specialties and preferences in reviewing papers.

3 how many papers should each member read?
  how many should read each paper?

4. answered.

5.  is there a time/necessity  for all to meet and discuss  papers 
    (first of May area?)
 
6. how many papers  are reasonable in three days.

7. demos and exhibits of lisp-like machines and applications? most definitely.

**8. PLEASE, PLEASE, ESTIMATE ATTENDANCE!!

9. housing should be directly through conference office? yes

10 answered

11. answered

**12. How much should we charge for registration? student rate?
    (bonus for advance registration)

13. How much should be  charged non-participants for conference proceedings?
    If possible, we should retain  rights to publish the proceedings; 
    Springer-Verlag has been suggested. How does ACM handle this on their
    proceedings?

**14. what are the expenses? (printing, banquet-buffet, sunday party)
    Of course, this relates to 12.

15. should we offer some "scholarships" to get some student help?

∂12-Oct-79  0837	JRA  
Burstall can't make it; suggestions for GB rep. would be  appreciated.
I suggest you phone Pat Hayes at 321-2052 to ask for suggestions.
∂12-Oct-79  0923	CET  	MTC Qual 
To:   JMC, ZM
Any news on the MTC Reading List.  We really need to move on this and
then get the Qual scheduled.
Carolyn Tajnai

∂12-Oct-79  1002	DPB  	Forsythe lectures  
To:   "@FAC.DIS[1,DPB]" at SU-AI 
Message from Gene Golub:

Has anything been done on the Forsythe lectures for this upcoming year?  Some
of us were rather unhappy about the way it went last year, viz the talkswere
overly technical and the series was hurriedly organized.

Reply:

I plead guilty to the charge that last year's Forsythe lectures were hurriedly
organized.  That was one of those "little extras" that were sent to me to
handle.  EAF's prejudice is that the faculty doesn't like being bothered with
this kind of thing; so I get to do it.  I don't mind, but lately I have had to
reexamine priorities.  I don't do very well at "polishing" affairs like
the Forsythe lectures or the CSAC meetings, largely (I think) do to the
high degree of fragmentation in my job.

Yes, the lectures turned out to be "too technical".  Discussions with Rabin
seemed to indicate that he planned a more "popular" set of lectures.  I also
was disappointed.  Jim Wilkinsons are mighty hard to find.

I have not even thought about this year's series yet.  With Ed gone and other
things pressing I completely forgot.  So I'd like to request that anybody with
ideas for speakers or energy to help with the organization contact me as soon
as possible.  And I'd like to thank Gene for the reminder.

-Denny

∂12-Oct-79  1153	JRA  	pat hayes
receptionist said "he's home sick"  (or "he's homesick")

candidates who come to mind are mike gordon and bruce anderson.

You can phone him at 494-8670.
∂12-Oct-79  1231	RPG  	Pitch    
To:   LES
CC:   JMC   
	This is a written version of the verbal pitch I gave to JMC and
LES concerning getting a DD in JAX. Since I maintain, at no cost, MacLisp
for the Verification group, the Hand/Eye group, and a host of unattached
PhD students and others (MFB, PAM, FHL, RPG, DES), I feel that a DD is a 
reasonable, minimal recompense for these services. Furthermore, since I
will not have a large number of books and papers in JAX, I am willing to
be moved to an office with minimal space; I do not mind being in the basement.
	Since the termination of Stanford funding for me I have continued
to maintain MacLisp, and have reduced the severity of the PDLOV problem, which
plagued nearly all users (except myself, since I programmed around it),
and which alleviates indefinitely the urgency for hardware revisions to the KL.
This fix required many hours of work and changes throughout the 600 page
MacLisp source. Thus I have proceeded in good faith with respect to a valuable, 
free service, and I urge you to consider this proposal.
			-rpg-
Sounds plausible.
∂12-Oct-79  2321	PAT  	10 copies
each of elephant and circumscription are in your mailbox.

∂13-Oct-79  0140	POURNE at MIT-AI (Jerry E. Pournelle) 	Dr.Possony says hello
Date: 13 OCT 1979 0438-EDT
From: POURNE at MIT-AI (Jerry E. Pournelle)
Subject: Dr.Possony says hello
To: JMC at SU-AI

	Dr. Possony was watching me play about with the net and
we got a message from Hans Moravec.  Steve asked Hans to 
convey his regards, and I pointed out he could do the same 
directly...Jerry P
	Steve says he hopes to see you soon...






∂13-Oct-79  0800	JMC* 
call susie for sarah's address

∂13-Oct-79  0800	JMC* 
reprints:
mental,first,hoter,elephant,circum,concep
raincoat, etc.
trunks
xerox from airline guide
acm publicity
m.i.t. letter

∂13-Oct-79  0915	PN  	Mail and file storage during the move   
To:   S1 at SU-AI 
   The distribution lists that will be shipped to SCORE during the move
are on [SCR,S1].  You should put yourself in any that you are interested in.
Use either 1) A SCORE user name  2) an ARPANET address 
3) A SCORE file.  If you don't have any of the above, mail a note to GIO.
Also, please put your during-the-move address in PPNS[SCR,S1].
All mailing lists and logs will be kept in CSD.WIEDERHOLD.

   At this point, based on talks with those who ought to know, it seems highly 
unlikely that any files that are on-line
at SAIL when it moves will get lost.  GIO has generously volunteered to
spend some time FTPing files to SUMEX.  A list is being kept in FILES[SCR,S1].
Good candidates for the list are:

    1) Large files that you will want to edit during the move 
    2) New files that will not have been backed up much before the move.

  It has been pointed out that disk space and cycle time at SCORE will both
be in high demand during the move, and since the S-1 project is not paying
for any of these currently, it is important that it (the project) not put
a drain on either of these.   

∂13-Oct-79  1806	EJM  	score for homework 
To:   CLT at SU-AI
CC:   DPB at SU-AI, "@FAC.DIS[1,DPB]" at SU-AI  
My understanding of the arrangements for getting score were that
the University turned down the proposal that they should support
a fraction of the system for class use and that consequently we
were to avoid using it for homework.  The more we provide other
facilities for class use, the more the University will continue
to under support LOTS.  Perhaps the time has come to ask them
for more support for LOTS or support for SCORE.  I'm against
subsidising the academic budget anymore.  What could easily
happen is that SCORE becomes just as difficult to use as LOTS.

My belief is that SCORE shouldn't be used for class assignments
unless some research project is willing to pick up the cost.

∂13-Oct-79  1815	EJM  	Speakers for Tuesday colloqia
To:   JDM at SU-AI, CET at SU-AI, "@FAC.DIS[1,DPB]" at SU-AI   
I'm not sending any suggestions for speakers.  I spoke at
a colloquim last spring.  Presented a talk which I had
already given for a couple of COMPUTER FORUM company visits.
I found the colloquim audience the most impolite one which
I have ever had the misfortune to address.  I have given 
talks at a number of Universities in the last few years
and was shocked at the attitude presented by the CSD
audience.  I don't think that the change from having a
faculty member in charge of the Colloquim has been a success.
			Ed McCluskey

∂13-Oct-79  1823	EJM  	Recruiters in classes   
To:   CET at SU-AI, DPB at SU-AI, "@FAC.DIS[1,DPB]" at SU-AI   
It's hard to believe that the proposal to have
BTL recruiters give a sales pitch in a CLASS
is serious.  The students (or someone) are paying
for a class not a sales pitch.

There are lots of ways for a company to reach the
students.  EE has all kinds of special meetings,
wine and cheese parties, etc.  Sally Burns should
be consulted about this since she has lots of
experience in setting up things for the Forum
companies.

Sales pitches in classes! No
Better to have cows in Berkeley
		Ed McCluskey

∂14-Oct-79  0129	RPG  	Haunt    
To:   JMC, HPM    
Here's how you can save the state of HAUNT and resume. At an input
point, type "α" (alpha).  This puts you in a ↑B breakpoint. Then say
"(suspend)". You will be thrown to the monitor.  SSAVE the core image.
When you run it, it will say "NIL". Type "(return '(()))". This will
be interpreted as a `stupid command' by HAUNT, but should allow you
to continue ok.
			-rpg-

∂14-Oct-79  0744	HPM  	orchids  
Brenda Starr is the leading character in a "romantic" newspaper comic
strip of the same name. Basil Saint-John is a mysterious character
of independent wealth, with an eye-patch, who shows up in Brenda's
life from time to time. Among his other activities, he raises black
orchids. Unfortunately, my source doesn't remember exactly how the
orchids are processed; she remembers something about a vial (she
last read the strip 12 years ago). 
	The evidence is pretty good; Dear Bas, in the closet note,
and "you've escaped the St. John's curse" in the productions.

∂14-Oct-79  1537	CLT  	PURGING  
To:   LES, HVA, JMC    
I am upset and discouraged about the recent purge.  
I think it was done in an unacceptable manner.
I don't view random threats that a purge will occur as sufficient notification.
Particularly as a large part of the reason that I was over allotment was
due to working core images in my area which could easily have been
taken care of, if a definite time of purge was set.  

I lost valuable files including a large portion of the book John and I are
writing, virtually the entire text of a tutorial on proving fact about
LISP programs in FOL that I had hoped to finish before the move, and
material needed for the course I am currently teaching.

A lengthy search told me that I will have to restore files from at least
36 tapes in order to continue this work.  To add insult to injury,
I made two attempts yesterday to begin restoration and was unable to
get anywhere.  

I would like help restoring the missing files.  Work on the above mentioned
projects and others simply won't continue until that happens.

				Carolyn

∂15-Oct-79  1136	LCA  
To:   LES, JMC, ME, HVA
It was my understanding that during purges dump files, rel file, tmp files
were to be purged first.  It seemes to me that purging the oldest files
first is completely wrong.  Clearly those files which are old and not
deleted explicitly are probably those explicitly kept!!!  This purge (the
change in style was not announced or the time) will cost me an entire day
of work to recover from this mess.

∂15-Oct-79  1223	LES  	Purging  
To:   LCA
CC:   JMC, ME    
Sorry that you are being inconvenienced.  Unfortunately, when we run out of
disk space, purging is the only thing that can keep the system going.

It is clear that there is no single purge order that will suit everyone.
That is why the purger accepts different specifications via your option.txt
file.  For a description of how to use this feature, see PURGER.REG[UP,DOC].

∂15-Oct-79  1430	TOB  	Lockheed 
To:   HVA, JMC    
Lockheed is in the process of putting through
money for the second year.

∂15-Oct-79  1450	ME  	new WAITS DM   
To:   JMC, WP, FWH, TOB, BIS, ZEN
It is possible that the new WAITS DM you just got may have a slight modem
problem.  You should be able to tell whether or not it does by making the
following test, which is only valid if begun with the terminal off and
having been off for at least THREE HOURS (preferably overnight).  Please
report the results of this test to me.

	First make sure that the short cord coming from the back of the
	terminal is plugged in to the LINE jack on the back (the place it
	is normally plugged in for using the terminal with the modem).
	Then, with the terminal completely cold (off for 3 hours or more),
	turn the terminal on and observe the screen for 2 minutes without
	typing anything at all on the terminal.  If there is a modem
	problem, then some random characters may appear on the screen,
	probably at the top.  If there is no problem, then the baud
	display at the bottom of the screen will remain displayed for the
	entire two minutes.  Note, once you have done this test, you
	cannot do it again for at least three hours, as a certain suspect
	capacitor takes that long to completely cool down.

If the terminal (modem, actually) flunks this test, then it will be
necessary to bring at least the modem back in for two or three days so
that it can be repaired (the modem card is not very hard to remove).
However, as long as you have the terminal (and modem) you can continue to
use the terminal, although you should let it warm up for a minute before
calling up the computer.  (And then, if there is any garbage on the
screen, push the red Reset button.)

See DM.ME[UP,DOC]/5P for more details on how to use the terminal.

∂15-Oct-79  2030	Bulnes at OFFICE-2 	hello.    
Date: 15 Oct 1979 1944-PDT
From: Bulnes at OFFICE-2
Subject: hello.
To:   jmc at SU-AI
cc:   bulnes

i would like to stop by at your office to bring you a bound copy of
my thesis (as promised) and take the opportunity to chalt.
-------

∂15-Oct-79  2030	Bulnes at OFFICE-2 	in case my previous message did not get 
Date: 15 Oct 1979 1946-PDT
From: Bulnes at OFFICE-2
Subject: in case my previous message did not get
To:   jmc at SU-AI

Date: 15 Oct 1979 1944-PDT
From: Bulnes
Subject: hello.
To:   jmc at SU-AI
cc:   bulnes

i would like to stop by at your office to bring you a bound copy of
my thesis (as promised) and take the opportunity to chalt.
-------
thru, as net trouble was reported at the time of sending,
here it goes again; if already received, disregard.
-------

∂16-Oct-79  0831	JRA  	call for papers    
To:   "@TLC.DIS[1,JRA]" at SU-AI 
i have had only a couple of responses on the information i sent out
last friday. any comments must be received before oct 22.
					john

∂16-Oct-79  0956	JRA  	important letter   
the conference office needs a letter from you to hold our space
for the lisp conference.  necessary ingredients are below; i leave the
content and style to your judgement. by the way, i found lois to be a most
pleasant individual; alas, she is on vacation and her stand-in is over-bearing
and obnoxious; i hope you dont have to deal with her!
--------------------------------------------


Lois E. Fariello
Conference Manager
Housing Management/Conference Office
128 Encina Commons

Dear Ms. Fariello:

This is a request for conference facilities, housing, and
food services  for the 1980 LISP Conference.

Name: 1980 LISP Conference

Dates: August 24-27, 1980 (Sunday through Wednesday)

Approximate attendance: 200-400

Program Head:	John R. Allen
		Stanford Artificial Intelligence Lab
		Stanford University
		Stanford, Cal 94305
		497-4971


Local Arrangments Head:	Dr. Ruth E. Davis
			Department of EECS
			University of Santa Clara
			Santa Clara, California   95053
			984-4358

Sponsor: Stanford AI Labs

Estimated costs for  either a sit-down
banquet, or an informal evening buffet would be most helpful.
Indications of incidental fees (e.g. audio-visual aids) would 
also be appreciated, since we must  specify a registration fee quite 
soon.


∂16-Oct-79  1339	DCL  	New Data Media terminals
To:   LES at SU-AI
CC:   JMC at SU-AI, FB at SU-AI
CC:   DCO at SU-AI, DCL at SU-AI   
Les,
Over 18 months ago I asked you to order 5Dms for the PV group, two on NSF
funds and 3 on ARPA funds from the groups capital equipment share.
We have had repeated conversations and net message agreements on this.
I have given you a list of people to recieve the 5 new DMs, and you agreed to this
list.

As you know, because of our lack of space in Jacks hall, these terminals are
really essential to us; three of them are slated for use in CSL and
not as home conveniences.

So far we have received two.
Today you point blank refused to give me one.
You say you now want one for your own home use, and I am not to have one.
This would have gone to a CSl secretary.

It is clearly time that JMC or someone refereed this problem.

Would you kindly state what you plan to do, so that an outside decision can be made.
-David

∂16-Oct-79  2031	Mark Crispin <Admin.MRC at SU-SCORE> 	AI Lab disk space at SCORE 
Date: 16 Oct 1979 1900-PDT
From: Mark Crispin <Admin.MRC at SU-SCORE>
Subject: AI Lab disk space at SCORE
To: CSD.Tajnai at SU-SCORE, CSD.DBrown at SU-SCORE, Les at SU-AI
cc: Admin.Gorin at SU-SCORE, Admin.Mo at SU-SCORE, JMC at SU-AI, ME at SU-AI,
    CSL.FB at SU-SCORE

Carolyn, Denny, Lester, & etc.:

     The head alignment on the new drive at SCORE has been
finished, so I've declared the AI: disk officially up for users.
The <CSD> directory on AI: has 60,000 pages out of 76,000 pages
on the pack [1 page = 512 words or approximately .5kwd].  I've
reserved the remaining space for possible other purposes but will
probably release it if no such "other purposes" come up.

     AI: is a "domestic" disk structure - this means that all you
need to do is create a directory with the same name as the user's
name on the public filesystem and set its allocation.  Do NOT set
a password.  For example, if CSD.TAJNAI is to get 2,000 pages on
AI:, you would do:

	!BUILD AI:<CSD.TAJNAI>
	!!WORK 2000
	!!PERM 2000
	!!
	!

     For CSD.TAJNAI to use this space, she merely has to say
CONNECT AI: - no password is needed.  She can also reference all
the files on AI: without connecting just by putting AI: in front
of the filename.

     Of course, this means that all SAIL users who will off-load
onto SCORE during the move will need CSD accounts.  This doesn't
seem to be too serious a problem, since most AI people already
have CSD accounts.  There may possibly be a problem with the AI
people who are affiliated with CSL instead of CSD, but since CSL
currently has 6000 unallocated pages on the public filesystem I'm
not going to worry about it right now.  [However, this is one of
the reasons I kept some space aside...]

     It would probably be a good idea to start on this right
away to allow two weeks for people to get their important files
onto SCORE.  I am planning to keep AI: around for two weeks after
SAIL is back on the air to allow people to move their files back
to SAIL, after which that disk pack and drive will be made into
the third pack of the public filesystem.

     As far as disk space allocation policy on AI: goes, that is
completely up to you (CSD and AI) to decide, not us (SCORE).  I
would, of course, be happy to provide any assistance you may
require in setting things up.  I don't know if the AI management
wants to establish any kind of policy on disk space; if so, it
would be a good idea to communicate this to us as soon as
possible.  I suggest that a list be made of the AI people who
will off-load onto SCORE and what their disk space needs will be
for the duration of the move.

     Please be sure that the two-week expiration after SAIL comes
back on the air is well-advertised, as SCORE needs the space for
its own users and the sooner AI is off the sooner I can make it
available to SCORE users.

Mark
-------

∂16-Oct-79  2132	RWW  
To:   "@FOL.DIS[FOL,RWW]"   
What:  A Godel Escher Bach party for the author, Doug Hofstadter!
When:  Friday, Oct 19, 8:00.
Bring:  Friends!!  Paradoxical objects of interest.  Foods if you like.
Where:  Richard Weyhrauch / 12625 La Cresta Drive / Los Altos Hills,
	CA 94022 / 415-948-2149
At the suggestion of:  Scott Kim / 415-329-9081
Directions:  (from Palo Alto)

Starting from either El Camino, Foothill Expressway or Hillview:
Go on Arastedero toward 208.  Just before you go under the 280 bridge,
turn left on Purissima (if you go under the bridge you've blown it).
Go to the stop sign.  Turn left on Viscaino - go up the hill.
La Cresta is the third right (if you go over the top of the hill back up).
I am the second house from the end on the right.
There is:	a black unmarked mailbox outside;
      		a lot of trees next to the road;
		usually lots of cars out front.

PS.  You might think that turning left off Arastedero at the
La Cresta sign is a short cut, but you'll lose.

∂17-Oct-79  1113	EF at MIT-AI (Edward Fredkin) 
Date: 17 OCT 1979 1410-EDT
From: EF at MIT-AI (Edward Fredkin)
To: JMC at MIT-AI

Hi, I have a question, in my copy of RECURSIVE PROGRAMMING IN LISP, dated
22:47 on September 19,1977, on page 35 you give the functions for
alpha-beta.  In particular, maxval, maxval1, maxval2 and their "min"
equivalents.  I have actually used these functions (as part of teaching
LISP)and I have a question.  The way I have programmed successors, it
eventually becomes NIL, and things loop forever.  I can see ways to fix
this, but I would like to talk to you to understand what you had in
mind... The functions are in AI:EF;G5 >
    Regards,  Ed

∂17-Oct-79  1122	DCO  
To:   "@GROUP1[1,DCO]" 
 ∂16-Oct-79  1327	Waldinger at SRI-KL (Richard Waldinger) 	talk on program synthesis at sri thurs, 10/18, 2pm    
Date: 16 Oct 1979 1328-PDT
From: Waldinger at SRI-KL (Richard Waldinger)
Subject: talk on program synthesis at sri thurs, 10/18, 2pm
To:   dco at SAIL, suzman at SAIL, laaser at PARC-MAXC
cc:   waldinger

Can you pass this message on to interested parties:

Prof. Ruth Davis of the University of Santa Clara will give
a talk Thursday (Oct. 18) at 2pm in Room L3081 of Building 30.
The talk concerns her recent thesis work under Prof. Sharon
Sickel at UC Santa Cruz.  Building 30 is at the corner of 
Ravenswood and Pine in Menlo Park. The lobby will be alerted.

Abstract follows:

	  GENERATING CORRECT PROGRAMS FROM LOGIC SPECIFICATIONS


It has been observed that an algorithm consists of two separable
components, logic and control.  The description of an algorithm can be
programming-language-independent.  We have designed and implemented
a system that accepts logic specifications, generates algorithms in an
intermediate language, and then translates these algorithms into
programs in specific target languages.

We shall discuss the system, the requirements for extending it to new
target languages, and further work suggested by the project.




-------

∂18-Oct-79  0122	LES  	Terminal tiff 
To:   DCL at SU-AI
CC:   JMC at SU-AI, FB at SU-AI, DCO at SU-AI   
David,

In response to your message of 16 Oct. regarding Datamedia terminals, If
you wish to end our association here with a tiff then I am willing, but I
think that you are choosing the wrong issue.  Your recollection of
computer terminal plans is both distorted and self-serving.

Over the last two years or so a number of people, including you, have
urged that we purchase more remote terminals for home use.  You and David
Oppen had Datamedia 2500 terminals at that time and were eager to get more
of them for your group as soon as possible.

I held out for buying Datamedia 3025's with the full SAIL character set
and you eventually concurred with this plan.  When the design
specifications were finally completed in January of this year, we looked
at all of our grants and contracts and ordered all that we could:  10.

Your remark that "I asked you to order 5Dms for the PV group, two on NSF
funds and 3 on ARPA funds from the groups capital equipment share" is total
bullshit.  I figured out how many we could afford and told you: 6 from ARPA
funds, 2 from your NSF account, and 2 from McCarthy's NSF account.  The
ARPA terminals were NOT pre-allocated to projects.

Some time later, you asked me how many more terminals you could have in
addition to the two had already.  Knowing that we would be getting some
back from Cordell Green's group, I said that five looked reasonable.
You somehow decided that all five should be new ones and started telling
me that.  Initially, I neither agreed nor disagreed, but simply said,
"let's see when the time comes".  Somewhere along the line I may have
agreed that you could have five new ones, but I did not and do not feel
bound by that.  Terminal allocation is continually changing and is always
based on considerations of "What do we have?" and "What do we need?"

The new terminals are now arriving and I told you last week that you can have
a total of 8 terminals -- 4 old and 4 new.  This is one more that we originally
talked about.  You became very agitated over the fact that you were not
getting 5 new terminals.

Your remark that "Today you point blank refused to give me one" is correct
but grossly misleading -- there were no new terminals that were both
functioning and that had property stickers.  I told you that you could
have two more of the new ones in addition to the two your group has already
but that you would have to wait.  I also stated that I plan to replace my
2500 with one of the new ones.  I offered you another Datamedia 2500 for
your group that was ready to go and you refused it.

I find it strange that you originally urged that we buy more DM 2500's rather
than waiting for the 3025's, but now you want only 3025's.

In the course of our heated discussion, I promised to document where the
terminals came from and how I plan to allocate them.  Here is where they
came from.

Source	P.I.    IMLACS	DM2500	DM3025	Total

ARPA	McCarthy  2	  9	  6	  17
NSF	McCarthy		  2	   2
NSF	Luckham		  1	  2	   3
NSF	Manna		  2		   2
NSF	Binford		  1		   1
NSF	Chowning	  1		   1
		---	---	---	 ---
Total		  2	 14	 10	  26


Now here is how I plan to distribute them among projects after we receive
the rest of the new terminals and retrieve the last two from Cordell
Green's group.  Note that the two rightmost columns show "Users", by which
I mean heavy participants in the project, and "terminals/user".  I do not
wish to quibble about the exact number of users in each project, but
believe that these estimates are fairly accurate.

Project	P.I.    IMLACS	DM2500	DM3025	Total	Users	Term./user

F.R.	McCarthy  2	  2	  3	   7	  10	    .7
P.V.	Luckham		  4	  4	   8	  10	    .8
M.T.C.	Manna		  2		   2	   5	    .4
H.E.	Binford		  4	  2	   6	  20	    .3
Music	Chowning	  1		   1	  30	    .03
Ad./Sys.Earnest		  1	  1	   2	   8	    .25
		---	---	---	 ---
Total		  2	 14	 10	  26

Thus your group will have both the most new terminals and the most terminals
per user overall.  So what is your complaint?

∂18-Oct-79  0208	Great Pumpkin	Restored Files  
Here is a status report on your PUMPKIN requests:

Tape	File					Status

P1220	WRITIN.PUB[BOO,JMC]←WRITIN.PUB[LSP,CLT]	Restored
P1220	READIN.PUB[BOO,JMC]←READIN.PUB[LSP,CLT]	Restored
P1226	MKCHAP.DO[BOO,JMC]←MKCHAP.DO[LSP,CLT]	Restored
P1226	LSPDOC.PUB[BOO,JMC]←LSPDOC.PUB[LSP,CLT]	Restored
P1226	LSPBIB.PUB[BOO,JMC]←LSPBIB.PUB[LSP,CLT]	Restored
P1226	LCOMAP[BOO,JMC]←LCOMAP[LSP,CLT]		Restored
P1208	PREFAC[BOO,JMC]←PREFAC[LSP,CLT]		Restored
P1208	INDEX[BOO,JMC]←INDEX[LSP,CLT]		Restored
P1227	LCOMAP.PUB[BOO,JMC]←LCOMAP.PUB[LSP,CLT]	Restored
P1227	BOOKEM.CMD[BOO,JMC]←BOOKEM.CMD[LSP,CLT]	Restored
P1564	SEARCH[BOO,JMC]←SEARCH[LSP,CLT]		Restored
P1564	SEARCH.PUB[BOO,JMC]←SEARCH.PUB[LSP,CLT]	Restored
P1564	PROVIN.PUB[BOO,JMC]←PROVIN.PUB[LSP,CLT]	Restored
P1564	PROVEX[BOO,JMC]←PROVEX[LSP,CLT]		Restored
P1564	PROVEX.PUB[BOO,JMC]←PROVEX.PUB[LSP,CLT]	Restored
P1564	MACHIN[BOO,JMC]←MACHIN[LSP,CLT]		Restored
P1564	MACHIN.PUB[BOO,JMC]←MACHIN.PUB[LSP,CLT]	Restored
P1564	LSPBIB[BOO,JMC]←LSPBIB[LSP,CLT]		Restored
P1564	IMPURE[BOO,JMC]←IMPURE[LSP,CLT]		Restored
P1564	IMPURE.PUB[BOO,JMC]←IMPURE.PUB[LSP,CLT]	Restored
P1564	EXTEND[BOO,JMC]←EXTEND[LSP,CLT]		Restored
P1564	EXTEND.PUB[BOO,JMC]←EXTEND.PUB[LSP,CLT]	Restored
P1564	ERRATA.F79[BOO,JMC]←ERRATA.F79[LSP,CLT]	Restored
P1564	COMPUT[BOO,JMC]←COMPUT[LSP,CLT]		Restored
P1564	COMPUT.PUB[BOO,JMC]←COMPUT.PUB[LSP,CLT]	Restored
P1564	COMPIL[BOO,JMC]←COMPIL[LSP,CLT]		Restored
P1564	COMPIL.PUB[BOO,JMC]←COMPIL.PUB[LSP,CLT]	Restored
P1564	BOOK.DIR[BOO,JMC]←BOOK.DIR[LSP,CLT]	Restored
P1564	ABSNTX[BOO,JMC]←ABSNTX[LSP,CLT]		Restored
P1564	ABSNTX.PUB[BOO,JMC]←ABSNTX.PUB[LSP,CLT]	Restored
P1552	REQ.TEX[BOO,JMC]←REQ.TEX[1,CLT]		Restored
P1552	REQ.MSG[BOO,JMC]←REQ.MSG[1,CLT]		Restored

∂22-Oct-79  1035	JRA  	updates  
To:   "@TLC.DIS[1,JRA]" at SU-AI 
First, these  updates are  status reports  on our  progress. They  are  an
attempt to be somewhat  democratic. You may respond  to them if you  wish.
You may ignore them if you wish.   Each will include a "respond by"  date;
the date for this one is Oct 25, 1979.

The  topic:  It  has  been  suggested  that  North  Holland  publish   the
proceedings as a book. They require that conference participants  purchase
a copy; their estimated costs would  increase the reg. fee by $10-$15.  Is
it worth it? Are there academic or "psychic" benefits to having a paper in
a published proceedings versus proceedings produced by us? Clearly the cost
of a local publishing job is much less.

other info: Patrick Greussay has joined us. I am still trying to locate
someone in England. Rod Burstall, Mike Gordon, and Chris Wadsworth have
been tried; I'm back on the phone tomorrow. Suggestions?

					john

∂24-Oct-79  1041	JRA  	lisp conference    
To:   "@TLC.DIS[1,JRA]" at SU-AI 
Our committee is formed!!! Peter  Landin and Bruce Anderson completed  the
list. I am  attaching a reasonably  complete call for  papers; due to  the
impending demise of SAIL,  I cannot wait to  get the final details  worked
out with North  Holland before posting  this. Therefore the  dates in  the
call reflect a successful contract with NH; if it falls through, the dates
will be revised.   Please decorate  the text with  your favorite  document
producer (I will US MAIL  an xgp-ed, but our xgp  is losing now) and  post
the call  locally, and  get people  stirred  up. With  our topic  and  the
quality of our committee we will have an incredible conference!!

Since SAIL is going away for a while, you will have to call me
for urgent matters; home phone is (408)353-3857 or leave a msg
at SAIL.

call follows:
--------------------------------------------
Oct 24 *********** semi-final DRAFT  ***********

Note: this version assumes that final agreements with North Holland
are acceptable; since SAIL is going down for an indeterminate length of time
it was critical to get this  out. The dates below reflect the eight-week
period that North Holland requires. This revision does NOT change the 
due-date for papers, it squeezes the review and revision periods.
.next page

.select 4
.begin center
CALL FOR PAPERS

1980 LISP Conference
.end
.select 1

The 1980 LISP Conference  hosted by Stanford University,  will be held  on
the Stanford campus, August 24-27, 1980. A proceedings will be published;
tenatively by North Holland.

%2PURPOSE%1
Many areas of contemporary computer science have their spiritual roots  in
developments related to  LISP.  These
areas  include   machine   architecture,   systems   design,   programming
methodology and technology,  and a  theory of computation.   The call  for
papers reflects this breadth.


%2TOPICS%1 
The following  topics are typical, but not exclusive: 
.begin indent 5,10
%2Languages and Theory.%1 
Applicative languages, Object-oriented languages, Proving correctness
of LISP programs, Mathematics and formal semantics of LISP-like  languages.

%2Programming Aspects%1 Programming tools and environments
for LISP-like languages, Applications of these ideas to other languages.

%2Architecture.%1 The design and implementation of LISP hardware,
Adaptation of existing machines, 
Specially designed LISP machines.

%2Applications.%1 Non-traditional applications of LISP. This area, of
course, is not easily categorized.
.end
%2PAPER SUBMITTAL%1 Authors are requested to send four 
copies 
of a full draft paper not exceeding 4500 words,
and a one-page abstract, by  March 14, 1980 to:
.BEGIN tabit1(15)
Conference Head
John R. Allen
Stanford Artificial Intelligence Lab
Stanford University
Stanford California 94305
(415)497-4971
.END
The abstract should provide sufficient detail to allow the committee
to apply  uniform criteria for acceptance. Appropriate references and
comparison to extant work should be included. The papers will be "blind
refereed". Traces of authorship should not appear within the body
of the paper; this information should appear %2only%1 in a cover letter
to the conference head.

Authors will  be notified of acceptance or rejection by May 16, 1980.
For inclusion in the proceedings, final papers are due
 by June 27, 1980.

%2PROGRAM COMMITTEE.%1 The committee consists of:
John R. Allen, 
Bruce Anderson,
Richard Fateman,
Dan Friedman,
Eiichi Goto,
Patrick Greussay,
Tony Hearn,
Carl Hewitt, 
Alan Kay,
Peter Landin,
Joachim Laubsch,
John McCarthy,
Gianfranco Prini,
Erik Sandewall,
Carolyn Talcott,
and
David Wise.


In charge of Local Arrangements is:
.BEGIN TABIT1(15);
Dr. Ruth E. Davis
Department of EECS
University of Santa Clara
Santa Clara, California   95053
(408)984-4358
.END


%2MEETING FORMAT.%1
Besides the formal sessions, we expect to have several
demonstrations, including LISP machines.

Evening sessions  may be established, and informal workshops will be 
encouraged.


%2PANEL DISCUSSION.%1 Tuesday evening, August 26, 1980, there will be a 
panel discussion on the
topic "What is LISP?". Even informal conversations will 
elicit several divergent if not contradictory views of LISP;
a organized effort should prove even more illuminating.

∂24-Oct-79  1444	RPG  	HPM 
To:   JMC
CC:   ME    
	Before Lester left, I talked to him about HPM taking the
machine down Saturday and/or Sunday AM to finish his movie
before the Lab moved. Since HPM has been working fast, furious, and
late, he didn't get a chance to make any contingency plans for using the
bare machine this weekend if necessary. Somehow I've been elected to
make the case to you about it. I assume some tempers will need to
be satisfied, so if you could ok the downtime perhaps the film can
be made before it is much more difficult.

	Thank you.
				-rpg-

∂25-Oct-79  0259	ME  	downtime for HPM movie   
 ∂24-Oct-79  2048	ME  	downtime for movie    
RPG mentioned that you might like to use some system down time this weekend
before the move in order to finish your movie.  If that is true, how much
downtime might you need?  What is the state of your work that you need to
finish this before the move?  It is probably possible, assuming it isn't
too much downtime and no one objects violently.

HPM - I'm filming live scenes of the cart on the rampage.  The move marks the
end of my involvement with the physical cart.  Because of lack of space,
and the many cables and antennas and things that would have to be set up
even if space were found, i don't expect to get the cart running on
campus, though eventually someone else may.  My program works, and I've
filmed late night obstacle avoiding runs (taking 5 hours of real time
because of system load) in the conference room. The outdoor scenery is
nicer, and I've yet to get a successful outdoor run. The main problem is
that system load climbs rapidly after sunrise.  With a bare machine a run
could be done in 2-3 hours. It would have to be in daylight; after 9 am
and before 3 pm. Saturday 9 to noon would be nice. The weather is the main
uncertainty; it can't be done in the rain. The weather people say it will
rain Sunday.

ME - John, do you have any objections to a 3-hour downtime Saturday morning
from 9am to noon so that Hans can film an outdoor cart run?

∂25-Oct-79  1035	Mark Crispin <Admin.MRC at SU-SCORE> 	Dialnet sources  
Date: 25 Oct 1979 1032-PDT
From: Mark Crispin <Admin.MRC at SU-SCORE>
Subject: Dialnet sources
To: JMC at SU-AI

DEC has gobbled down my release 3A Dialnet sources, and a gnome there
is working on it now.
-------

∂25-Oct-79  1505	g.eldre at SU-SCORE (Tim Eldredge) 	Dialnet  
Date: 25 Oct 1979 1456-PDT
From: g.eldre at SU-SCORE (Tim Eldredge)
Subject: Dialnet
To: admin.gorin at SU-SCORE, admin.mrc at SU-SCORE, jmc at SU-AI

My  management  requires   that  I   have  some   "official"
permission from Stanford  in order  for me  to purchase  the
Dialnet modems and to implement  Dialnet here at HP.   Could
you please  provide  me  with  such  a  thing?   I  am  most
interested in providing this service  to my users, and I  am
willing to provide time for development of Dialnet  software
on my machine.

Thanks
Tim Eldredge
-------

∂25-Oct-79  2019	Mark Crispin <Admin.MRC at SU-SCORE> 	[g.eldre: Dialnet]    
Date: 25 Oct 1979 1727-PDT
From: Mark Crispin <Admin.MRC at SU-SCORE>
Subject: [g.eldre: Dialnet]
To: Les at SU-AI, JMC at SU-AI

Please take care of this.
                ---------------
Date: 25 Oct 1979 1456-PDT
From: g.eldre
Subject: Dialnet
To: admin.gorin, admin.mrc, jmc at SU-AI

My  management  requires   that  I   have  some   "official"
permission from Stanford  in order  for me  to purchase  the
Dialnet modems and to implement  Dialnet here at HP.   Could
you please  provide  me  with  such  a  thing?   I  am  most
interested in providing this service  to my users, and I  am
willing to provide time for development of Dialnet  software
on my machine.

Thanks
Tim Eldredge
-------
                ---------------
-------

∂26-Oct-79  0829	JRA  	north-holland update    
To:   "@TLC.DIS[1,JRA]" at SU-AI 

originally I had expected to print and bind the conference papers  locally
at minimum  cost.   Dan  Freidman  suggested  that  publication  would  be
worthwhile. Considering the  quality of  the conference,  it seemed  worth
going for.  the  original deal with  NH would have  the bound  proceedings
available on AUG  24. Upon further  reflection it seemed  to me that  this
scheme would  leave  out  much  of the  conference  activity  --the  panel
discussion, invited  talks,  etc--  and probably  this  excellent  program
committee would never all be gather together again.

Therefore I have revised negotiations such  that NH will produce the  full
conference, and I will  come up with the  funds for local reproduction  of
the papers for the actual meeting, rather  than add more money to the  reg
fee. The additional funds are  approx $2000-3000 (retail reprod.   rates).

This way, attendees will have access to the papers and will be assurred of
having the  final  proceedings  (included  in  reg  fee  --probably  about
$12-15-- and  mailed to  attendee  by NH)  as  a research  and  historical
record.

Comments, criticisms, and suggestions will be accepted until SAIL dies  on
Monday morning.

						john

∂26-Oct-79  1032	PAPERT at MIT-AI (Seymour Papert)  
Date: 26 OCT 1979 1304-EDT
From: PAPERT at MIT-AI (Seymour Papert)
To: jmc at SU-AI

If you are not already completely scheduled would you like to
have dinner Tues or Mon evening? It seems like a million years
since I have spoekn with you. If yes, who specially else wou;ld you
like...Marvin will probably be out of town but if here would come.

∂28-Oct-79  0753	PMF  
If you are getting rid of the magazines in the basement of the lab, I
would like the CACMS, IEEE trans. on Computers and IBM JRD.

∂17-Nov-79  1142	RWW  	HELLO    
To:   "@FOL.DIS[FOL,RWW]"   
We are back in business!!!!  Hope you all log on soon.
richard

∂26-Nov-79  0449	RMS at MIT-AI (Richard M. Stallman)
Date: 23 NOV 1979 0615-EST
From: RMS at MIT-AI (Richard M. Stallman)
To: JMC at MIT-AI

Is Dennett still out there?  Because I have just read "Brainstorms",
and I think I have some criticisms of his position on mental images,
which I would like to send to him via you if he's there.

∂30-Nov-79  1013	JRA  	return (marginally)
To:   "@TLC.DIS[1,JRA]" at SU-AI 
well, SAIL and JRA are back (at least marginally). Because of the tight
space crunch in the new SAIL location I will probably have to run the 
conference out of my living room! access to the machine and other
facilities may improve,
but for now if you want to reach me, the best thing is to call me at
home at (408) 353-3857, or write at 18215 Bayview Drive, Los Gatos CA 95030.

on a more pleasant note, the call for papers got out, thanks to a last minute
shipment of the text to PARC and Bill McKeeman. I piggy-backed our call
with that of the  AI conference (which preceeds us by a week at stanford).
that covered some of the us  audience; i got the foreign segment of the
IJCAI mailing list and sent them copies; CACM, AISB, EATCS, and about
two-dozen universities (us and foreign) have been notified.  

the ACM is in a bit of a muddle, but I think sigplan, sigam, sigart, sigact
and sigsmall will carry our call. "i think", because random bureaucrats
have told me confilcting accounts about almost all phases of this venture.
(e.g. i sent info to symposia/conference people asking them to list the
conference, and supply sponsorship information; they claim they never got it
yet we're listed in this months CACM! 'nother e.g. at least one sig-ffical
believes that a sig cannot list an unsponsored conference!) so far,
i have seen no compelling reason for ACM sponsorship.

so far i have seen no compelling reason for sponsorship. three reason have been
given:

1) tax-exempt status: that certainly is an issue, but as yet there is no
   glimmer of profitability in this venture; that brings:

2) financial security: so far i've spent about $300 in phones, postage and
   mailing; clearly i'll be in the hole deeper before advanced registrations
   appear, but i don't see any major losses or profits; we should end up with
   a little surplus (which would go into the tax-exempt corp)
  *******IF I AM BEING NAIVE ABOUT THIS PLEASE TELL ME *****
   furthermore ACM officials tell confliciting stories about their financing
   and since symposia/conference people never responded it makes it difficult
   to judge.

3) sponsored conferences get better attendance and papers; that seems like
   bullshit to me, but if true please tell me.

several things must begin  after the first of the year: 
 locate people who are willing to demonstrate lisp equipment; 

 locate people willing to support some of the cost ($2000-3000 retail) to 
   duplicate the advanced papers for the attendees; 

 get hard figures for registration fees and get publicity started.

if i have forgotten something, or you have questions, please call me!


					john

I think you're doing fine.  I think the benefits of sponsorship
are marginal, and the costs of intereaction with all those
ACMocrats would be substantial.
∂30-Nov-79  1116	TOB  	proposed move of robotics    
John
I would like to follow up on the reservations you
had about the proposed move of robotics to Pine Hall.
I mean what you mentioned about the move of AI to
the former lab.  

I have strong reservations and most students are
opposed to the move.  It will take until mid year
to prepare if we were to do it.
Tom

∂30-Nov-79  1129	TOB  
To:   LES, JMC    
Move to Pine Hall
  comments
  decision
  benefits
  requirements
  costs


Comments
  I dislike moving machines to replace people.
  Machines can be remote more easily than people?
  Robotics, of all groups, is most dependent on close contact with the machines.
  Robotics needs space.
  CS loses a good visitor attraction.  Robotics makes good visuals.

Decision
  Whether?
  If so, when, how?

Questions
  TI
  ethernet load

Benefits
  space
    Institute
    geographic identity
    expansion
    VAX
    separate administration


Requirements
  partitions (noise level)
  phone system
  Xerox
  supplies
  offices for students near completion who stay (assume 2)
  adequate ethernet
    It is likely that the ethernet will be heavily loaded with file
    transfers when 15 ALTOs and DOVER are doing file transfers.
    Xerox experience is that it is lightly loaded.  Possible ethernet gateway.
  people
    secretary/manager
    engineer
    access to systems staff
    software person (possible)
  computer system
    hard copy device
      Canon Laser Printer with software
    terminals
      character displays - how many??
      remote access lines
        phone lines or keyboard lines
    robotics laboratory
      ethernet interface for PDP11/45
      bootstrap for PDP11/45, ROM, disk
    display system + terminals
      options
        1.  character displays plus Grinnell graphics
        2.  Datadisc simulator
      ALTO
      Grinnell interface to ethernet
      video switch
      Grinnell software
      modify PIX and existing display software to use Grinnell
      Datadisc simulator on Grinnell computer
        WAITS software for Datadisk server to Robotics
    VAX ??
      
Costs
  summary:
    About $43,000 for equipment.  How much available now?  Who will pay?
    About 2 man months of system software work.
    About 6 man months of robotics effort.
  time/research progress
  less exposure to cs students, less contact with cs dept
  less exposure to facilities
  system 
    hardware 
    software
  moving robot laboratory
    minimal preparation, moving and getting back on air    2 months
    About 4 man months to move the robotics laboratory;
  display 
    terminals 11 @ $2500
    monitors  11 @ $500
    video switch  8x10  $10,000 Dynair
    About 2 man months of software for display system beyond what is needed
    without the move.

∂30-Nov-79  1411	LGC   via SU-SCORE  
Is there a number where I can reach you now?

∂30-Nov-79  1418	LGC  
My phone number is 272-2908 (San Jose).

∂30-Nov-79  1508	Morton at PARC-MAXC 	Re: request for information  
Date: 30 Nov 1979 3:07 pm (Friday)
From: Morton at PARC-MAXC
Subject: Re: request for information 
In-reply-to: Your message of 30 Nov 1979 1410-PST
To: John McCarthy <JMC at SU-AI>
cc: morton at PARC-MAXC 

Non-Monotonic Logic I
Drew McDermott and Jon Doyle

A Logic for Default Reasoning
Raymond Reiter

Dianne Morton

∂30-Nov-79  2033	HPM  	∂30-Nov-79  1814	JMC  	xgpsyn     
To:   JMC at SU-AI
CC:   ROB at SU-AI, REG at SU-AI, ME at SU-AI   
It would be nice if it worked since it could take some load off
the flakey XGP while few terminals are available.  None of Ralph,
Martin or Rob understand what hardware is involved.

[It does work, if you select C (for your own channel) mode. Just type C<cr>
to any PAGE question before requesting the page you want to see. It does
not use gray scale in this mode, and the quality of the display is
reduced.

For gray scale, Alan Miller has installed all the coax necessary to
operate the video synthesizer. The main thing lacking is the ELF intrface,
which operates the video intensity table.  I note the UNIBUS already runs
into the Kludge bay, but is unconnected there, so, barring unforseen
problems, an hour or so of work could get the ELF interface working.
						---HPM              ]

∂01-Dec-79  0145	HPM  	XGPSYN   
I set things up so XGPSYN picks  own Channel  mode automatically.

∂02-Dec-79  2239	LGC   via SU-SCORE 	Reminder  
See you at 11:30 on Monday ...

∂03-Dec-79  1132	Lamport at SRI-KL 	logicians  
Date:  3 Dec 1979 1132-PST
From: Lamport at SRI-KL
Subject: logicians
To:   jmc at SAIL

John,

It occurred to me that logicians working in modal logic might
be interested in what I've been doing in temporal logic.
In particular, I've discovered that the type of temporal logic
needed in computer science isn't the same as any of the logics
that logicians have been studying.  Is there enough interest
among Stanford logicians for me to give a talk there?  And
if so, who should I talk to?

Les
-------
Professor Jon Barwise of Philosopy is the most likely to be interested.
My own motion has been in the opposite direction.  I have come to the
opinion that the explicit use of time is better for most purposes in
computer science and maybe in AI and philosophy.
∂04-Dec-79  0751	Sandelin at SUMEX-AIM 	possible meeting 
Date:  4 Dec 1979 0751-PST
From: Sandelin at SUMEX-AIM
Subject: possible meeting
To:   jmc at SAIL
cc:   bair

would it be possible to meet briefly sometime in the next couple of weeks
to discuss 1. recent developments in the text handeling/messaging planning
project and 2. possible involvement in a symposium to be held at Stanford
the end on March?  I could arrange lunch at the faculty club if that would
be convenient.
-------
If it's just the two of us, would it be convenient for you to come out
to the Center for Advanced Study in the Behavioral Sciences, say for
lunch some noon.  You can reach me there 321-2052 most afternoons.
Otherwise the Faculty Club is possible.
∂04-Dec-79  1758	100  : MRC	TIP dialup procedures   
To:   JMC, DGL    
The character to do hunt recognition on the TIP is "E", not escape or
carriage return.  If any other character works, it is completely
accidental.

∂05-Dec-79  1053	Horowitz at MIT-XX 	reprint permission for Lisp 1.5 manual  
Date:  5 Dec 1979 1353-EST
From: Horowitz at MIT-XX
Subject: reprint permission for Lisp 1.5 manual
To:   mccarthy at SU-AI

Dear John,

John Guttag, Barbara Liskov and myself (Ellis Horowitz)
are planning to publish a book which will essentially be
an anthology of papers on programming languages.
We are interested in reprinting the first 20 pages of 
the Lisp 1.5 manual.  I spoke to MIT press and they are 
unable to determine who actually owns the copyright.
Therefore they suggested that we ask you for your permission
while they look back in their files to see if the copyright
was ever applied for.

For your information the publishers of the other papers have granted
us permission and charged us a fee, usually around $100-$200,
as long as the author agrees.  We would be happy to pay a 
similar fee in this case if the owner of the copyright can be
ascertained.

Sincerely,
Ellis Horowitz
-------
You have my permission for a $150 fee, payable half to me and half to
Mike Levin who has shared royalties.
∂05-Dec-79  1133	Card at PARC-MAXC 	Re: reports     
Date: 5 Dec 1979 11:31 am (Wednesday)
From: Card at PARC-MAXC
Subject: Re: reports   
In-reply-to: Your message of 04 Dec 1979 1909-PST
To: John McCarthy <JMC at SU-AI>

What I have is a technique with which you can analyze (perhaps
parametrically) the way in which a particular task is accomplished with a
particular system and predict the time it will take.

From applying it to some examples from Bravo (mouse oriented) and EMAX
(keyboard oriented) one can make the following observations.

1.  If the hands are mostly on the keyboard and must reach to the mouse, the
operation will require
   Home to mouse     .4 sec
   Point               1.1 sec
   Home to keyboard .4 sec
           TOTAL     1.9 or roughly 2 sec.

So a keyboard editor to beat the mouse editor must select its target in < 2 sec,
and, in fact, quite a bit less than 2 sec if it is to have time left over to
crow about (assuming roughly the same amount of time for the modification
commands in both systems).  This is quite possible in some circumstances, at
least, although not too easy.  If something like step keys were used it would
surely be a lost cause.  With an 8 character search string plus a 1 character
command name plus a 1 character terminator and assuming instantaneous
system response and .2 sec/keystroke you already have used 10 x .2 = 2 sec.
And because you are invoking a command my current model says you have
to add 1.35 sec preparation time.

On the other hand, if you are filling in a form and simply need to say, go to the
next field, or if you are comparing typing a one keystroke command name to
pointing to an item in a command menu, then the keyboard is going to win
hands down.

2.  But there is another advantage of the keyboard system.  If you are a secretary
making edits marked by someone else on a paper text, with the mouse system
you have to search to find your place in the text, then search the screen to see
where to point.  With the keyboard system you may only have to do this once. 
The second search is done by the machine.  Searching the screen might add 2
sec to the time for the mouse system.

3.  When I worked out four examples using both EMAX and BRAVO it was
pretty much a dead heat, Bravo was very slighly faster for three, EMAX faster
for one.  Bravo was faster in the command execution part, but suffered because
the users had to search the screen.  Of course these weren't a representative
sample of tasks, but the rough places were the sytems were vulnerable was clear
enough.

4.  In our version of NLS in which the user keeps his hands on the chordset and
the mouse, only rarely going to the keyboard (some users type text at 40
words/minute with their left hand on the chordset) the mouse might say .8
sec/point, making it harder to beat.

5.  Finally, if we are comparing whole systems, the learning time must be
considered.  A keyboard system must use a set of commands to do the pointing
instead of the rather direct method of pointing with the mouse and so users may
have more commands to learn.  If we exclude systems hackers, who can learn
almost anything, and look to the general population, then there is evidence that
(1) TECO and EMAX are harder to learn than other systems [Roberts in here
thesis found TECO much more difficult than any other editor to learn;  a
graduate student at Illinois with whom I have had contact reports great
difficulties in teaching secretaries EMAX] and that (2) the mouse is not too
difficult [training of White House and Congressional staffs on Bravo have
confirmed this informally;  experimental systems studies by BBN using Altos
with social secruity personnel, while less positive, seemed to indicate no great
difficulty in learning to use it].

The above are, of course, gross generalizations; it really depends on the specifics
of a particular case.  I have certainly seen several grossly inefficient uses of the
mouse where keyboard commands would have been vastly superior just because
someone assumed the mouse is always best when it isn't.  I'm sending you the
papers that contain the details of how we do an analysis.

Stuart Card

Much thanks for the information.  If I have reactions, I'll write you.
∂06-Dec-79  1628	TOB  	reference list
John
I put in your mail box a copy of the file which I will
send following this message.  If there are any changes
required, let me know.
Tom
I got it, and it looks adequate.  How about Chern as a reference?
∂06-Dec-79  1629	TOB  
Adjunct    References


References from
  B.K.P.Horn, MIT
  P.H.Winston, MIT
  Rosenfeld, Md
  R.Reddy, CMU
  M.Brady, Univ of Essex
  D.Waltz, Univ of Illinois
  R.Kirsch, NBS
  John O'Callaghan, CSIRO, Canberra
  Ruzena Bajcsy, Univ of Penn
  T.Kanade, Kyoto Univ
  J.Feldman, Rochester
  H.Barrow, SRI

compare with
  A.Rosenfeld, U.Maryland			
  D.Marr, MIT
  Horn, MIT
  Shirai, ETL, Tokyo
  Riseman, UMass
  K.S.Fu, Purdue
  J.M.Tenenbaum, SRI
  H.Barrow, SRI
  
Prof Mike Brady
 Computer Center
 University of Essex
 Colchester, Essex, UK
Prof B.K.P.Horn
 Artificial Intelligence Lab
 MIT
 545 Tech Square
 Cambridge, Mass, 02139
Prof. Patrick H. Winston
 Artificial Intelligence Laboratory
 MIT
 545 Tech Square
 Cambridge, Mass,02139
Prof Jerome Feldman
 Department of Computer Science
 Mathematical Sciences Building
 University of Rochester
 Rochester, N.Y. 14627
 (716) 275-5671
Prof T.Kanade
 Dept of Inform Science
 Kyoto Univ, Kyoto, Japan
Prof Raj D. Reddy
 Computer Science Dept
 Carnegie Mellon University
 412-621-2600
Prof. Azriel Rosenfeld
 Computer Science Center
 University of Maryland
 College Park, Md, 20742
 301-454-4527
Dr. George Giralt
 Laboratoire d'Automatisme
  et d'Analyse des Systemes (LAAS)
 Complexe Aerospatial
 31400 Toulouse
 France
 61-531177
Dr. Y. Shirai
 Electrotechnical Lab
 2-6-1 Nagatacho,Chiyodaku
 Tokyo,Japan
Prof Ruzena Bajcsy
 Moore School of Engineering
 University of Pennsylvania
 Philadelphia, Pa, 19104
 215-243-6222
 2316 Delancay St.
 Phila, Pa, 19104
Dr. J. O'Callaghan
 CSIRO Div Comp Res
 Box 1800 Canberra City,2601
Dr. David Waltz
 Coordinated Sciences Laboratory
 University of Illinois
 Urbana, Illinois,61801

∂07-Dec-79  1026	TOB  
 ∂07-Dec-79  0057	JMC  
I got it, and it looks adequate.  How about Chern as a reference?

John
Chern would be ok.
Tom
Please mail me Chern's current address.
∂07-Dec-79  1247	TOB  
;07-Dec-79  1215	JMC  
Please mail me Chern's current address.

Dr. Bernard Chern, Program Manager
 Division of Applied Research
 Rm 1126
 National Science Foundation
 1800 G St. NW
 Washington, DC, 20550

∂07-Dec-79  1609	Sandelin at SUMEX-AIM 	meeting
Date:  7 Dec 1979 1609-PST
From: Sandelin at SUMEX-AIM
Subject: meeting
To:   jmc at SAIL

If ok, I would like to include Jim Bair of Bell Northern
Research in our meeting.  Jim is program chairman for the Stanford symposium
on can describe what we are about better than I.  I will cover the planning
efforts on text processing systems and how the symposium fits in.  The 
title is "emerging office systems: why some work and others fail"  It is aimed
at designers and implementors of such systems, focusing on the
interface between people and the machines.  Next thur. or fri. would be good
for us. If this is convenient, would you designate the time and place.
thanks...
-------
OK, Friday noon at Faculty Club
∂08-Dec-79  1725	LES  
 ∂08-Dec-79  1717	JMC   via AMES-TIP  
Don't we need more telephone lines?

We have added 2 split-speed lines on the direct connection (497-0081)

∂09-Dec-79  1000	JMC*  via SU-TIP    
Call Pat.

∂10-Dec-79  1000	JMC*  via AMES-TIP  
Call Miro, paper for UCLA.

∂10-Dec-79  1237	LGC   via SU-TIP 	Discussion Notes 
The file DISCUS.TXT[1,LGC] contains my retrospective reconstruction of our
discussion last Friday; I found the reconstruction process to be stimulating
and valuable.  I have probably over-interpreted you at some places and
under-interpreted you at other places, but at least the notes should provide
a basis for further discussion.  My understanding is that we are to meet
again tomorrow (Tuesday) at 2 p.m.

∂10-Dec-79  1556	HEARN at UTAH-20 	LISP Book   
Date: 10 Dec 1979 1552-MST
From: HEARN at UTAH-20
Subject: LISP Book
To: mccarthy at SU-AI

John, I hear that you and Carolyn Talcott are working on another LISP
book. Any chance I could see a draft?
Thanks,
Tony
-------

∂10-Dec-79  1756	LGC   via SU-SCORE 	Copies of Notes
Will it be an easy matter for you to XGP two double-spaced copies of
my discussion notes, or should I try to do it before we get together
tomorrow?  (The file is DISCUS.TXT[1,LGC])
I'll do it. - John
∂11-Dec-79  1435	LYN  	music party   
Hello!  Patte and I wanted to be sure you knew about the Christmas pot luck
this Sunday at 4:00. I put a message on the system but am sending out 
individual notes to those I think would be especially interested.  Our FOONLY
has arrived!  I hope you can come.

∂11-Dec-79  1631	Wilkins at SRI-KL 	my thesis  
Date: 11 Dec 1979 1632-PST
From: Wilkins at SRI-KL
Subject: my thesis
To:   jmc at SAIL

I have a nice bound copy of my thesis for you.  When could we get together
so I can present it to you?  Let me know if and when you'll be on campus
and I'll come see you there or else I could stop off at the Institute.
David
-------
Phone me at the Center some afternoon.
∂11-Dec-79  1900	JMC*  via SU-TIP    
Discuss pseudo-or with CLT.

∂12-Dec-79  0550	LES  	printing on Versatec    
The set of available fonts is currently very limited, aside from
the TEX fonts.  The latter are not safe to use because they have
bizarre substitutions in many important character positions.
Unfortunately, there is no reasonable italic font available.
Consequently, I set up your file with a typwriter font in place of
italics.

To print it, first run Pub, then EXecute XGPDVI[S,LES].  It will ask
for the name of the XGP file.  If you add a switch of the form
"/ID=score user name" then when it finishes converting the file
it will load your line editor with an FTP command to move the
resulant file to SCORE.

After you get the file there, Telnet to SCORE, log in, and say
"VSP<alt> <file name>
This will spool the file for printing on the Versatec.

∂12-Dec-79  1506	CMB at MIT-ML (Clark M. Baker)
Date: 12 DEC 1979 1806-EST
From: CMB at MIT-ML (Clark M. Baker)
To: jmc at SU-AI

	I am a graduate student at MIT, working with Prof. Joseph Weizenbaum.
Joe is in urgent need of information about Dr. Egbert Lehman, a professor of
computer science in Dresden, E. Germany.  Lehman and his wife have recently
received jail sentences of 2 1/2 years and 1 year, respectively.  Joe is very
interested in investigating the Lehman case, and suggested to me that you might
know of Lehman.
	Anything you may know about Lehman would be very useful to Joe; for
instance, to what extent is he a member of the AI community, what do we know
about his work, etc.  Please contact Joe immediately at the following address:
		Gastehaus der TUB
		Heerstr. 131/135
		1000, Berlin 19
		W. Germany
		home phone: 011-49-30-305-5760
or contact me at MIT:
		Ronni Rosenberg
		MIT Lab for Computer Science
		545 Technology Sq., #417A
		Cambridge, MA 02139
		office phone: 617-253-6038
	Your help in this matter is very much appreciated.
	Can you transmit to Ronni Rosenberg the fact that I know nothing
of Egbert Lehman, except having read in the newspaper that he had been
arrested?  The only East German computer scientist I know is the LISP
enthusiast Herbert Stoyan, who also lives in Dresden.
∂13-Dec-79  0806	Sandelin at SUMEX-AIM 	meeting
Date: 13 Dec 1979 0807-PST
From: Sandelin at SUMEX-AIM
Subject: meeting
To:   jmc at SAIL
cc:   bair

I have made reservations at the faculty club for this Friday at noon.
We will be in downstairs lobby at 11:55 am.  
-------

∂13-Dec-79  1711	MTC  	computer use by MTC
Right now, I am working on a pawn pass for my chess program. The chess
program uses SAIL's arm to move chess pieces on a standard board. The
program enables two players to capture other pieces (with the arm moving
the captured piece to the correct side), and castle ( king and queen
side). As soon as the arm becomes operational, I am going to test the
program further. Ken Salisbury told me that a link up between the PDP/10
and /11 will be possible, which will enable the chess prgram in the /10 to
play against other people with my program moving computers and humans
pieces.

P.S. I'd still like to play a game of chess with you if you have some free time.
Can I take you up in the offer?

∂13-Dec-79  1812	LGC  	Tomorrow at 2:00?  
Shall we meet tomorrow at the usual 2:00?  I have added a subsection to
DISCUS.TXT[1,LGC], clarified a couple of points, and broken it up into
two pages.  You'll probably want to go over the whole thing before we meet.
How about Monday at 2 instead?
∂13-Dec-79  2316	LGC  	Monday at 2 -- ok  
That's fine with me; let's do it then.  Monday, 17 Dec., at 2 p.m.

∂14-Dec-79  2010	JMC* 
diamox

∂14-Dec-79  2023	REM at MIT-MC (Robert Elton Maas) 	PCNet status   
Date: 14 DEC 1979 2226-EST
From: REM at MIT-MC (Robert Elton Maas)
Subject: PCNet status
To: MRC at SU-AI, JMC at SU-AI

Within the past month a UCSD PASCAL file-transfer program has been completed.
Within the next month we expect to fix a few minor incompatibilities between
it and PCNet standards (a couple places in the high-level protocol make use
of packet boundaries when parsing messages, which is forbidden), then after
testing we expect to proliferate it widely among at least 20 microprocessor
with modem systems in the bay area.  We're about 2 years behind our original
goals, but we're finally about to make some real progress toward a net.

∂14-Dec-79  2133	ARK  	DD terminals  
To:   ROY, ROB, ROD, ME, DPB, LES, JMC
The latest list of working DD terminals is in WIRE[CSD,REG]/2p.  They are the
ones that have a ⊗ on the line.  Since we are out of female BNC coax connectors
we cannot wire any more terminals until the end of the month.  Rod and I with
the help of numerous others spent an enormous amount of time on these terminals
and will have to go back to our normal activities.  We will probably not be
available to work on bringing up the remaining terminals as it will coincide
with the start of winter quarter.

Arthur

∂15-Dec-79  0235	RWG at MIT-MC (Bill Gosper)   
Date: 15 DEC 1979 0536-EST
From: RWG at MIT-MC (Bill Gosper)
To: STAN.K at MIT-MC, HPM at MIT-MC, jmc at SU-AI

i take it all back about npr-all things considered!
tonite i heard commentator john lofton(?) claim to
have called up the head of Musicians United for Safe
Energy (antinuke rock coalition) and accuse him of
hypocrisy, threatening to organize Nuclear Scientists
for Safe Rock Concerts.

∂15-Dec-79  1755	LGC   via SU-TIP 	New version of notes available  
A new revision of DISCUS.TXT[1,LGC] is now available; I'll try not to
make any more changes before we meet on Monday, so you can have a stable
document to read and comment on.  --  Lew

It doesn't matter to me if you change it further.
∂17-Dec-79  0730	Sandelin at SUMEX-AIM 	symposium   
Date: 17 Dec 1979 0730-PST
From: Sandelin at SUMEX-AIM
Subject: symposium
To:   jmc at SAIL
cc:   bair


Thank you for accepting an invitation to speak at our symposium.  A more detailed description of the program will be distributed in a couple weeks. A few
 items: 1.There is an honorium of $300, which may be augmented depending on
attendance i.e. a profit sharing plan of sorts 2. There is a coordination/get
acquainted meeting for speakers Tues evening, which will include wine tasting
and dinner..3/25/80..3. We will need a short biographical sketch, and also a
photograph if possible, for the symposium announcements.  Jill Liscomb. a
student working with us, will contact you directly on this item. 4. A paper
on the topic is optional, but would be valuable.  Whatever received by
3/1/80 will be part of a compendium of papers given to attendees.
   Thanks again...Jon Sandelin.....P.S.  We will be meeting with
some people at IBM's scientific center to discuss future text systems and
how the IBM/Stanford joint agreement might play a part.  I plan to suggest
a prototype faculty/student capability.  I will let you know of any meaningful
developments.
-------
Ralph Gorin and I have independently considered the 4331 as possibly playing
a role in providing student word-processing capability.  Therefore, I would
like to take part in discussions with IBM, if they are willing to consider
the matter seriously.  Additional development: since Friday the results have
come in on a survey by Les Earnest and Denny Brown on the number of terminals
required to put one on every CS desk.  The result is from 250 to 300 terminals,
which is a factor of two more than I and everyone else had supposed.  Therefore,
we need a very economical way of doing it, but I think we can do it with money
in hand.  At least we can get the central concentrator and more than half of
the terminals using a bit map.
∂17-Dec-79  0833	MAX  	terminal 
May I know when will a terminal be available in my office? (and a telephone?)
I'll work in the holidays and even harder.
						Ma Xiwen.
Please ask Hersche Allen about the telephone.  As for terminals, there
is a shortage of parts, and they expect more late this month.  Unfortunately,
there are often delays during the holiday season.  Some people have
increased their priority for terminals by volunteering to help install
them.  About half the Data-discs have been installed, so the next batch
should finish it.  I presume your office is scheduled for a terminal, but
you should ask Les Earnest for definite information.
∂17-Dec-79  0900	JMC*  via SU-TIP    
meeting 4:30pm 356 mjh

∂17-Dec-79  0842	MAX  	mclisp   
We will have an AI Lab in Peking University next year or later. It is suggested
to make the MCLISP there interchangeable with yours. May I get the informations
about the compiler/interpreter from SAIL? 
I have got a Manual, but it is unfinished, I think, because a lot of paragraphs
are marked as "draft". When will it be finished?
Of course, special interest will be on the machine-independent parts of MCLISP
compiler/interpreter.
How about the ALGOL-like versions of LISP? Are they useful for education or
programming?
If we had MCLISP on our computer, can we make FOL available without hard work?
Do you have any plan on realizing ELEPHANT on any computer? How about realizing
on DJS-18 in Peking University? I am thinking if I can suggest my students
to do it.
    						Ma Xiwen.
It will be worth your while to talk to more people than just me.

	1. You should talk with Dick Gabriel (RPG) about MACLISP (spelled
with an A).  He will know about the state of the manual and about its
exportability.  A replacement for MACLISP called NIL (for New Implementation
of Lisp) is being developed.  Maybe that should be your target.  Gabriel
will know about it.

	2. I formerly used an Algol-like source language for LISP called
RLISP in my course.  It worked ok, but I don't use it any more.

	3. You should talk with Richard Weyhrauch about FOL.  The current
version is not in MACLISP but in the older UCI LISP.  A new FOL is planned,
and it will be in MACLISP or possibly in NIL.  My guess is that you can
adapt the old version to MACLISP with some work or use the new one.  A lot
depends on the computer you will have at Peking and whether it has enough
memory.  It will be very difficult to remain compatible with American
LISPs or LISP based systems without rather large memory, since everyone
is planning to break out of the 256K word limitation of the PDP-10 as
soon as possible.

	4. Recently I have been emphasizing the aspects of Elephant
related to proving properties of sequential programs, and haven't
thought further about its direct use as a way of avoiding specification
of data structures.  I think it requires more thought before this can
be specified.  If you and Dr. Tang have ideas along this line, I would
be glad to hear about them.  In general, I would be very happy if some
version of Elephant were implemented at Peking University and would
help in any way possible.

Would it be possible to meet on these and other questions Wednesday at
2pm in my office in MJH?
∂17-Dec-79  1528	Nilsson at SRI-KL (Nils Nilsson) 	Henry Firdman   
Date: 17 Dec 1979 1526-PST
From: Nilsson at SRI-KL (Nils Nilsson)
Subject: Henry Firdman
To:   JMC at SU-AI
cc:   Nilsson

Henry Firdman is a Russian friend of mine who has been denied an
exit visa and is now without a job in the Soviet Union.  He holds
various advanced degrees in computer science and is an expert in
computer architecture, hardware design, and artificial intelligence.
Among his various publications is a 1976 book entitled "Algorithmic
Foundations of Intellectual Robots and Artificial Intelligence."
It is one of the better known Soviet books on AI.

Henry needs any help that might pursuade the Soviet authorities to
reconsider their decision about an exit visa.  He has been without
employment since November 1978 and has a wife and two small children.
He wants to continue his technical work and would welcome correspondence.
His current interests are in knowledge representation theory and in
natural language understanding.  

Henry's mother and younger brother have been able to leave the Soviet
Union and are now in Philadelphia.  They have been in touch with
various American scientists, including Jack Minker, Committee of
Concerned Scientists; they would also appreciate correspondence and
help.

Addresses:

Henry Firdman				Henry's mother:
Mytnynskaya str. 31, apt. 3		
Leningrad 193144			Mrs. Mina Firdman
USSR					1421 Kerper St., 2nd flr.
(phone 271-31-06)			Philadelphia, PA 19111


Thanks in advance for any help that you might be able to give.


--Nils Nilsson
-------

Hersche: Please have Firdman sent my recent "Ascribing mental qualities
to machines" and "Circumscription - A Form of Non-Monotonic Reasoning".
The former is an AI memo, and the latter is circum.new[s79,jmc] which has
to be pubbed.
∂18-Dec-79  0925	JK   
Must have misunderstood your message; waited from 4:30 to 4:45 around your
office yesterday. Try for another time?

∂18-Dec-79  0932	HVA  	POSTAGE CHARGE NUMBERS  
I showed Monica your msg. and she says she thought she had put numbers on all
outgoing letters, but is sorry if she forgot one.

∂18-Dec-79  0934	HVA  	JON DOYLE
Will send map today.

∂18-Dec-79  0935	HVA  	Other Mail    
Will try to handle today or Wed. Thks for putting note on my door--I'm without
terminal but should pop in Les' office each a.m. to keep up with the world.

∂19-Dec-79  1026	Bmoore at SRI-KL (Bob Moore) 	bug in AIPHIL.LST   
Date: 19 Dec 1979 1026-PST
From: Bmoore at SRI-KL (Bob Moore)
Subject: bug in AIPHIL.LST
To:   jmc at SAIL

I noticed that the file includes JCK (Jim King) rather than JCH
(John Haugeland).
-------

∂19-Dec-79  1636	TOB  
To:   LES at SU-AI, JMC at SU-AI, FB at SU-AI,
      feigenbaum at SUMEX-AIM, DPB at SU-AI  
Summary statement

Draft

Everyone who responded would like to stay in Jacks Hall.  It is very
important to maintain close contact with CSD.  Several think that a move
to Pine Hall would be good for robotics in the long run if there were
adequate space.

I favor the proposed move of the robotics research group to Pine Hall
provided that:
   1.  Computing  facilities  substantially equivalent  and  substantially
   compatible with those of SAIL  are provided, particularly displays  and
   hardcopy.  The group has no money for extensive equipment purchases.
   2.   Space  is adequate.   
   3.  Loss of research time is minimized.  All preparations are  complete
   at the time of move.  The move date is flexible in case of delays.
   4.  An assistant/secretary is hired by Feb 15 for robotics to help with
   administrative details.
   5.  An office in Jacks with  Datadisc service is provided for one  year
   for those who choose to remain behind.
   6.  Re-evaluation in case of unforseen difficulties.
   7.  Systems help is available for hardware and software.
Details follow in separate sections.

1.  Computing  facilities 
    Equipment  
	3  Ethernet Unibus  interface  boards (11/45, Grinnell, I/O processor)
        Terminals: 1 ALTO, 21 terminals 
          16 for offices, 1 for stereo station, 2 for machine room, 2 for robotics
          table
        19 monitors 
        video switch 
        Large disk Storage
            remote assistance for  UDP and tape 
        Canon  laser printer with  hardware and software  interface
        PDP11 for  I/O processor  
    Software 
	Ethernet server
	WAITS  display server  for  Grinnell
	Datadisc simulator  on Grinnell  processor  
	video switch software  	
	AL system display and Ethernet software
2.  Space:
    5 individual offices 100 sqft, 11 shared offices 150 sq ft,
    1 stereo station room  100 sq ft (dark) 
    1 conf/library room 150 sq ft
    machine  room area,  shop area  
    by 1981:  2 additional individual offices, 3 shared
3.  Timing 
    Be in a good  state for major conferences here.
    Minimize  lost research time. When  preparations are  adequate and  tested.
    Tentative date:  Nov 1980.  Flexible schedule (when ready).
    	KL10 on  Ethernet  Ethernet to  Pine  Hall tested - May 
        PDP11/45 to Ethernet - April 
        adequate terminal and display system.
          Grinnell acquisition March 1
          Grinnell hardware interface May 1
	  Grinnell software design complete March  1
	    implementation begin May  1,
            complete Oct 1, tested Nov 1

∂19-Dec-79  1617	LES  	Lost again    
To:   JMC
CC:   ME    
The Product Associates guy just showed up with a new modem card, which turned
out to be incompatible with the one that is in JMC's terminal.  He swiped
the latter and promised to bring it back modified tomorrow.

Incidentally, it appears that they have changed the physical layout of their
modem cards since they built ours.

∂20-Dec-79  0209	LES  	NS on SCORE   
To:   ME
CC:   REG, JMC    
JMC would like to consider moving News Service to SCORE in the interest of
preserving SAIL job slots.  It would also be a more transportable product
if it were running under TOPS-20.

REG says that isn't practical until some terminals get tied in to SCORE by
ethernet because of a shortage of TTY ports on SCORE.  Your assessment of
the size of the programming task is solicited, as well as any other
relevent issues.

∂20-Dec-79  0229	ME  	NS on SCORE    
To:   LES, JMC, REG
CC:   ME    
My initial feeling is that it isn't worth the effort of converting NS to
save a single job slot.  It would probably be a substantial programming
effort -- I don't know much about TOPS-20.  There would probably have to
be some TOPS-20 monitor mods done.  If there is money in exporting it,
maybe some of that money could buy programming effort (not mine).  The
display capabilities of NS are highly WAITS display service dependent,
although they could undoubtedly be made to work somewhere else.

If you want more job slots, the answer is obvious, very obvious.  Get the
Telnet servers put into the operating system.  The only time we ever run
out of job slots is when there are about 5 or more network TELSERs (and
SUPSERs, etc.)  providing TTY service for 5 other remotely controlled user
jobs (total 10 jobs).  MRC was planning to put the servers into the system
some time ago, but never quite got around to it.  One of the things
possibly holding it up was the lack of capability of the system itself to
support SUPDUP displays (the server does it, converting from DM codes to
SUPDUP codes), but now that the Extended Display Service is up, it
shouldn't be very hard to add SUPDUP displays to the list of supported
display terminals -- the extended display service was written with SUPDUP
kept in mind.

∂20-Dec-79  1606	LES  
 ∂20-Dec-79  1438	JMC  	Dennett as unknown 
I thought I did what has to be done to make DCD stand for Daniel Dennett.
What did I omit that leaves him still unknown?
----
Indeed, he is in the PEOPLE file.  Unfortunately, DPB recently changed the
format in a way that broke the FONDLE phantom and all its friends, such as
FINGER.  So I have to reprogram -- this weekend.

∂20-Dec-79  1609	LGC  	Tomorrow (Friday)  
Will you have more than a half-hour tomorrow at 2 p.m. for our discussion?
It looks as if I'll have quite a lot to say.  My new material won't all be
written up til tomorrow morning, so I'll try to get XGP copies made just
before we meet.

∂20-Dec-79  1811	ROY   on TTY62 (at TV-66)  1811    
There is carrier on both your transmitt and your receive lines now. Let me
know if the IMLAC doesn't work.  Roy.

∂21-Dec-79  1000	JMC* 
print locke

∂21-Dec-79  1325	LGC  	No Hardcopy Available   
Since the XGP is down for moving, we'll have to rely on on-line perusal
of my material.  In case you wish to look some of it over before I arrive,
the relevant places are DISCUS.TXT[1,LGC] page 3, and PRBSLV.TXT pages 4-5
(i.e., Sections III and IV).  A lot of the material is still in my head,
and not written up yet.

∂21-Dec-79  1349	LES  
 ∂21-Dec-79  1308	JMC  
SOB is broken.  After accepting DEC as date, it asks for ppn and crashes.

---
I know, it is part of the FONDLE phantom family.  Hopefully, this weekend.

Why did you agree to the file format change before having the new programs?
The previous was not just a rhetorical question; I need to know who controls
what.
∂21-Dec-79  1608	LES  
 ∂21-Dec-79  1353	JMC  
Why did you agree to the file format change before having the new programs?
The previous was not just a rhetorical question; I need to know who controls
what.
------
I had agreed to the file format change in principal, but not without
warning.  Things proceeded on SCORE beyond the point of return while
we were down.  DPB now recognizes the problem and is assisting me on
repairs.

∂22-Dec-79  0144	LES  
 ∂21-Dec-79  1700	JMC  
Besides that please have someone clean the exterior of the XGP.
------
Please try a different department.

∂23-Dec-79  1529	TOB  	hand proposal 
To:   LES, JMC, TOB    
I am making a proposal with Bernie Roth as PI
in connection with Carl Ruoff of JPL for the
JPL President's Fund.  It will be a small proposal
with about $19k for hardware, one ME student
designer, a small amount of Ken Salisbury's time,
a little of Ruoff's time, no charge for my time.

I need an amount to include for computer time.
Relatively little will be used since most of the
effort will be design.  Some use of documentation
and reports will be made.  

Please suggest a suitable charge.  Time is important.
ASAP.   LES.
Tom

∂23-Dec-79  2021	JMC   via SU-TIP 	rolex  
∂23-Dec-79  2114	REM   via AMES-TIP 	Deficiencies in MacLISP here on SU-AI   
To:   LES, JMC, TVR    
In addition to the longstanding bug in array allocation which RPG might
be trying to fix this or next month as time permits, I have found another
problem that will interfere with work on crunch (data compression) and
MRPP4 (super-POX document compiler) just tonite. SoftwareFileArrays, one
of the major features for handling streams of data as if they came from
a file even if they were pre-processed by a user-written co-routine, don't
exist here.  I have filed a BUG PLISP and hope to hear that it's an oversight
and it'll be remedied.  I'll give you an update if (1) SFAs get installed
here and work (2) MacLISP maintainers say it won't be done soon.  Meanwhile
I'll assume this is just a temporary problem preventing my new software from
working on this system.  (It works great on MC so far, but I think I'll
postpone further work on SFA software until I find out whether it will be
installed here soon.  I sort-of don't want to work a lot on software that
works on ITS but not here.)

∂24-Dec-79  1835	TOB  	display system
John
I will help in planning if you want the help.
I have looked at quite a few sources in evaluating
our Grinnell purchase.
Tom

∂25-Dec-79  1051	REM   via AMES-TIP 	CRUNCH of formatted documents 
To:   REM at SU-AI
CC:   JMC at SU-AI, LAUREN at UCLA-SECURITY
A prime example of my philosophy that the verbosity of prettily-formatted
documents eating up disk space can be relieved by my data-compression methods.
A few minutes ago I used LESCAL to prepare a 1980 calendar.  To avoid losing
it and having to print it twice I diverted it to the disk and planned to spool
it in a few days when I'm on campus.  To avoid tying up 16k of disk space
from now to then I decided to compress it using my on-the-fly adaptive
interval-refinement data-compression program using left-context Markov model,
IC2.  Original was 16476 words, compressed 1394 words, compression ratio 11.8
(pretty good!).

∂25-Dec-79  1719	REM   via AMES-TIP 	Software File Arrays - working
To:   RPG
CC:   JMC, TVR, LES   
Gee that was fast.  Thank.  I just now tried my program for extracting numbers
from a histogram-file, which I ported from MIT-MC a day or so ago (when I
noted that SFAs were missing here), and it seems to work ok.  Now I can
proceed with evaluating SFAs as a general mechanism to handle streams in
super-POX and word-oriented (dictionary-based) data-compression research.
That leaves the ARRAY ALLOC bug as the only known problem in MacLISP (I
haven't tried it in current PLISP, but assume it is in the same state as
when I last tried it yesterday or the day before).

∂25-Dec-79  2321	Feigenbaum at SUMEX-AIM 	(Response to message)    
Date: 25 Dec 1979 2321-PST
From: Feigenbaum at SUMEX-AIM
Subject: (Response to message)
To:   TOB at SU-AI, LES at SU-AI, JMC at SU-AI, FB at SU-AI

In response to the message sent 19 Dec 1979 1636-PST from TOB at SU-AI

Tom, I don't see too much problem with your various needs, except the equipment
list.  My problem stems from not knowing what your budgets are like.
Are you buying the Grinell system out of some budget of yours? Who is
supposed to pay for the various terminals? Your budget ? Department gift
funds? As to the latter, we generally do not tap these to help individual
projects meet their needs since they are needed for community efforts.

I hope you are viewing the proposed move to Pine Hall (if we get it) as a
way of gaining considerably more space, not as a way of bootstrapping
a new complement of equipment.

But, as I said, I'm sure I don't understand the situation.

Ed

p.s. I hope you understand that except for the gift funds the department is
essentially hand-to-mouth. We pay for the teaching program out of operating
budget + honors coop returns. The rest of the money is held by the individual
Principal Investigators for the research, and the department plays essentially
no role in the use of the research money.
-------

∂26-Dec-79  0038	LES  	FONDLE phantom
To:   REG, ME, ROB, DPB
CC:   JMC    
New FONDLE phantom up, so FINGER, RSL, MAIL, the purger, etc., should now
have more up-to-date info.  I still have to fix SOB and possibly BUREAU.

∂27-Dec-79  1751	Nilsson at SRI-KL (Nils Nilsson) 	Party 
Date: 26 Dec 1979 1545-PST
From: Nilsson at SRI-KL (Nils Nilsson)
Subject: Party
To:   JMC at SU-AI

                             !!!PARTY!!!


COME HELP CELEBRATE THE PUBLICATION OF NILS NILSSON'S NEW BOOK


                Principles of Artificial Intelligence
                      Tioga Publishing Company


Time and date:  4:45-6:30 pm, Tuesday, January 8, 1980
Place:  Keidanren Room (S109)
        The International Building
	SRI International
	Ravenswood Avenue, Menlo Park

Wine and Hors D'oeuvres -------------------- Books will be available for sale
-------

∂28-Dec-79  1702	Mark Crispin <Admin.MRC at SU-SCORE> 	Tops-20 Dialnet code  
Date: 26 Dec 1979 0302-PST
From: Mark Crispin <Admin.MRC at SU-SCORE>
Subject: Tops-20 Dialnet code
To: JMC at SU-AI, Les at SU-AI, Admin.Gorin at SU-SCORE, Admin.JQJ at SU-SCORE,
    G.Eldre at SU-SCORE, Admin.Bosack at SU-SCORE

I have finished the conversion of the DIALNE.MAC monitor code for release
4 of Tops-20.  Unfortunately, it required the creation of a new module,
DLNBUG.MAC, for the bugstring definitions (*sigh*).  But it's ready to be
put in GSB when they are to come up with 4 or LOTS, etc.
-------

∂28-Dec-79  2109	TOB  
To:   druffel at USC-ISI, JMC at SU-AI, JRA at SU-AI 
ADA appears attractive, however there are design decisions which limit
its generality for problems for which LISP has been the traditional
language.  I urge that a common portable LISP at the level of
MACLISP/LISP MACHINE LISP be implemented for a variety of machines
including Z8000, M68000, VAX, PDP11, PDP10, TI990.  The intention is
that it should not be greatly innovative and it should be portable
and widely available.  One company is working more or less along these
lines, The LISP Company, with John Allen.

∂28-Dec-79  2254	TOB  
To:   feigenbaum at SUMEX-AIM, JMC at SU-AI, LES at SU-AI 
To:   feigenbaum at SUMEX-AIM, JMC at SU-AI, LES at SU-AI 
Ed

The statement  described  equipment  which will  enable  us  to  establish
facilities equivalent to and compatible with those we use on SAIL here  at
Jacks.  None  of  it  is intended  to  add  new equipment.   We  want  new
equipment, but that is separate and was not mentioned there; we will  seek
funds for  new  equipment  from  our sponsors.  The  statement  refers  to
expenses which are only necessary if robotics moves remote from the KL10.

In many ways, robotics requires  the greatest effort in relocating  remote
from the KL10.  Perhaps 95% of  work uses Datadisc terminals as  character
terminals.  Our work cannot get  along with only character terminals.   We
use graphics  capability  of the  Datadisc  system and  the  video  switch
intensively in our work.  We cannot operate terminals to the Datadisc from
Pine Hall.  They must be directly connected to the video switch.

Display Plan

Our plan is  to maintain compatibility  with the current  system and  with
future developments.  A separate development effort would be suicidal.  If
the proposed move is carried  out, we plan to  use the Grinnell system  to
simulate the Datadisc.   We have  the money  for the  Grinnell system.   A
substantial software effort will be  required; we will do that  ourselves.
Some KL10  systems  programming  will  be required.   We  cannot  do  that
ourselves.

One proposal is  to use  Datamedia terminals in  connection with  graphics
displays connected to the Grinnell.  At  $2800 per Datamedia, this is  not
cost effective (over $50k  for terminals), and  it leaves us  incompatible
with Datadisc service.

A  video  switch  is  required   to  provide  graphics  capabilities   and
compatibility with the current system.

We want to take part in the department display system, whenever that comes
about.  It may not be in time for the proposed schedule for the move.

Printer

We require a printer local to Pine  Hall.  Les has talked about the  Canon
Laser Beam Printer with suitable hardware and software interfacing.

Financial

The bottom line  is that there  are expenses which  are only necessary  if
robotics moves to Pine Hall.  We did not plan on such a move and have  not
prepared for such expenses.  We  do not have a  lot of money for  hardware
now, and what we have is  earmarked for research.  I made fairly  detailed
evaluation of the requirements  but have not  completed evaluation of  the
total cost, pending a more complete vendor study.  The total cost seems to
be under $40,000.  More study may bring that down.

I do not  expect that gift  funds from  the department be  used to  handle
these costs.   I did  include these  in a  summary evaluation  to  provide
information that you need to be aware of what must be arranged to enable a
move.

Les has  suggested  that  the  cost  center  might  prn∂ide  some  of  the
equipment.   The   terminals   might  be   current   Datadisc   terminals.
Alternatively, we may find support from sponsors for the equipment, either
from ARPA or NSF.

∂30-Dec-79  0626	REM   via AMES-TIP 	English-text parsing and understanding in commercial environment 
You may be interested to know that Cullinane Corporation (Wellesley, MA),
one of the major commercial suppliers of database-management systems for
IBM et al computers, has announced this month in their "report" (newsletter/ad)
the purchase of rights to the ROBOT English language query system from
Artificial Intelligence Corporation, Rockville MD, for use with their IDMS
database management system.  From the one example they present, I get the
idea they have a usable system that attempts to understand English queries
to a DB, notes all ambiguities and asks the user multiple-choice for resolution,
then proceeds to answer the query.  If the example really is typical of the
level of English understanding the query system has, then in the limited
world of a particular database it seems to do as well as a human interfacer
would do (modulo lack of voice input).
Their next step is to integrate this English-query + DBM-access program with
their online query system.
(I got on their mailing list because a year or so ago I send in an ISR-card
from one of the computer magazines, trying to find out what the commercial
world had comparable to Dialnet and PC Net.  Nothing at all able to link
dissimilar machines together over phone line.)

∂02-Jan-80  0911	Levinthal at SUMEX-AIM 	Chess 
Date:  2 Jan 1980 0911-PST
From: Levinthal at SUMEX-AIM
Subject: Chess
To:   jmc at SU-AI

John, You may receive a call from a Dr. Edward Ginzton. Ed is Chairman
of the Board of Varian Associates and a trustee of Stanford. He also
is a good chess player.  He brought one of the commercial computer
chess games and having exhausted it's potential was curious about the
state of the art of computer chess. I gave him your name as the best
s;ource of information on this. Elliott
-------

∂02-Jan-80  1254	BTH  	Concurrent Programming Seminar CS319E/EE385E
To:   bboard at SU-AI, bboard at SU-SCORE,
      "@GROUP.DIS[1,BTH]" at SU-AI
The first meeting of the Concurrent Programming Seminar will
be held on Thursday, January 10, 1980 at 2:45 pm in
ERL237.  We will discuss when the seminar should meet and
what topics to cover.  Persons interested but unable to
attend should contact Brent Hailpern (BTH@SAIL) or Susan
Owicki (SSO@SAIL).

∂02-Jan-80  1733	SJF  	Optimization visitor    
To:   JLH, JMC, DCL, RWW    
Bob Paige, who got his PhD with Jack Schwartz at NYU and teaches at Rutgers,
will be visiting this area next week.  He'll be speaking at IBM and SCI, and
I was wondering about interest here in his work.  I may try to set up a
lecture for Tuesday, Jan 8, before the CS seminar.


 ∂25-Dec-79  1242	PAIGE at RUTGERS 	Abstract    
Date: 25 Dec 1979 1542-EST
From: PAIGE at RUTGERS
Subject: Abstract
To: sjf at SU-AI

TITLE:	Plans to implement formal differentiation--a technique for
	improving algorithms specified at an abstract level

		ABSTRACT

	Formal differentiation is a basic program optimization
technique which generalizes the classical method of 'reduction in
operator strength.'  This technique captures a commonly occurring yet
distinctive mechanism of program construction in which succinct
algorithms involving costly repeated calculations are transformed into
more efficient incremental versions.

	We have just initiated a project to implement set theoretic
formal differentiation capable of applying a host of program transformations 
extending Jay Earley's 'iterator inversion'.  The first stage
of our project calls for a semiautomatic implementation supported
by an experimental interactive program manipulation system similar to
ones developed by Standish and Loveman, but using a simplified variant
of SETL as a source language.  Use of this initial system is expected 
to supply empirical evidence leading to the development of a fully
automatic version which can be installed as part of a conventional
optimizing compiler.

	This work is relevant to the development of high level
languages and to program correctness technology.
-------